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Neither company has officially released any numbers, but Dave has stated that ROH had a goal in mind for the shows they've run and by and large once they got past the techincal issues that messed up the first few iPPVs they seem to be at or above expectations. TNA's buyrates as of late have been pretty damn close to statistically zero. Not to mention saying TNA should still be considered #2 because it once achieved things ROH has yet to do is kind of like saying the AWA was still a top level promotion in 1990 because they did big numbers in the 60s and 70s.

So does anyone else agree that ROH has passed TNA as the default #2 promotion at this point? I know their TV situation isn't 100% ideal, but it seems that in pretty much all other aspects they seem to be ahead of them.

On a related note, I just now realized I never knew $ was the currency symbol for pesos before seeing that pic.

Speaking of, I noticed how similar Dean and Seth's theme music is when I can't tell who's coming out until the song gets to the bridge.

It comes across to me that he definitely makes harder cases for/against certain folks and that it has a tendency to sway the results. He'd never come out and say "this guy better get voted in" but it's not usually hard to guess who he's rooting for either. I get he probably just wants everyone to have as much info as possible on all the candidates but it puts him in an awkward spot of basically having to advocate for guys who may not be as well known while being the one who keeps the castle so to speak.

I think people in the business probably care in the sense of realizing it's recognition from someone who's been covering pro wrestling for 30+ years but I doubt anyone loses sleep over falling off the ballot. Also all this discussion has made me kind of wonder what at PWO Hall of Fame would look like.

Yeah wasn't a big part of his entrance fans running up to the railing so they could get knocked over as he bulled his way to the ring?

Yes, that was great. I loved them using the guys who were probably the top legit bad asses as security, and Arn was great with his "you don't know who you're fucking with" style promo.

Even when the fans started chanting "boring" while guys were being loaded into the ambulances (they were at Disney and the fans couldn't see what was going on since there were no screens), the announcers were quick to mention they understand why the fans are upset since nothing had been going in on the ring for a long time but when they realize what happened they would understand. It added to the whole feeling of "these guys just straight fucked up our whole show". All this makes it even more amazing in retrospect that not only did WCW never get the decisive win, but the nWo ended up being the most popular faction in history as a result.

WWE seems to be treading very carefully not to be seen as doing anything like that since it appears by all accounts Alberto could own them if all the racism shit came out.

Watched the Nitro where the Outsiders attacked for the first time, and it's kind of a shame it's only known for Rey getting thrown into the production truck. The whole angle was excellent from start to finish. It starts during a six man between Sting/Luger/Savage vs Flair/Benoit/McMichael, Jimmy Hart comes out and is freaking out for the guys in the match to come help because the Outsiders are attacking people. Everyone ignores him for a while because it's Jimmy Hart and everyone there has a reason to distrust him (the Horsemen were feuding with the Dungeon of Doom and Sting's team were faces), but eventually everyone notices how scared he is and decides to check it out. They follow him to the back and find Arn, both American Males, and Rey all wiped out as Hall and Nash jump into their limo and run off. Savage tries to climb on the limo while it's moving and you see him drop into the sun roof just as the car ducks out of sight around a corner (also you can hear what seems like actual fans yelling for the limo to stop because there's a crazy man flailing on top). From there you have what might be Tony Schiavone's best work as an announcer, noting how both teams from the match are putting their differences aside in the face of such carnage. Sting is shown attending to Bagwell as Tony mentions their out of the ring friendship, and the rest of the Horsemen are shown with Arn. Woman is yelling for someone to get an ambulance as Flair is attending to him while Mongo is stomping around like an angry bull, which is exactly how you'd expect a football jock like him to react in this situation. Eddy is shown with Rey as the announcers mention they were supposed to have a match for the Cruiserweight title later that night, and he relayed that Rey saw four attackers. The rest of the show carries on with an air of fear and uncertainty. When Bischoff and Heenan come out to announce hour two, Bobby tells him that with his history of neck problems and WCW's inability to guarantee security he's not doing the show and leaves. Larry and Tony stay with Eric, and the first match after has the Steiners vs High Voltage. Larry mentions how the young guys haven't been around long enough to have any concern for the people who were beat up, while Rick Steiner especially is being distracted by what happened. All in all it was one of the most well done angles in terms of everyone involved playing their parts perfectly. If it was done today, we'd have announcers overselling everything and wrestlers not reacting at all.

TNA supposedly is talking to a few different networks, you'd think if anything was substantial they'd announce a deal by now. From the ones Dave has mentioned that were in the running, Ion would make the most sense even if they offered less money since it's in more homes than even Spike.....but I don't see how Impact would fit in their schedule of Ghost Whisperer reruns.

He was busy running around in sequins and mascara with Jimmy Jam in 1992, wonder how 2014 PS feels about that.

The time from when Hall and Nash first showed up on Nitro up to Bash at the Beach was the most insane time to be a wrestling fan on the internet. There were just enough people who kind of knew what was going on and tons of people who thought they did, Every day it seemed there was a new rumor.

Yeah I wonder if these behind the scenes jobs were given as thinly disguised hush money so word doesn't get out that Bill DeMott is killing people in developmental. Wasn't that the reason they have cameras everywhere but in the shitters now?

So Corey Graves is in the WWE2K15 game despite being out of action pretty much all year due to concussions, which reminded me of something. Wasn't there some sort of issue with guys in NXT getting career ending injuries in training that kind of got swept under the rug? I recall Dave tip-toeing around it a few times on various radio shows, If I recall correctly there were a few people who were alleged to receive buyouts/payoffs to keep quiet, and anyone who makes a peep about what went on in training seems to get dogpiled immediately. Was there something to that, and if so why would any of the usual reputable news places not say anything about it?

Saturday Night Slam Masters has a lot of wrestler homages, since it's basically a Capcom fighter cosplaying as a wrestling game. A ton of mid 90s action/fighting games have a Hulk Hogan type since that seemed to be the default "American character" look in Japan.

Also re: the board...I don't think anything needs changed or improved (other than lasers of course). The "PWO is a monolith of opinion" seems like an excuse made by people who get mad when they are asked to provide reasons for said opinion. I'd wager if someone came here and stated they feel a well regarded wrestler sucks, and stated the reasons why they feel so, people here would probably be accepting of that viewpoint even if they don't agree with it.

How about laser cats instead?

In terms of heels supporting causes, I liked how Lana was wearing a pink pocket square in her suit jacket on Raw. Support the cause but not in a heel-undermining way.

Hogan was off filming a movie/TV show somewhere which is why he was gone. In fact, the last Observer prior to Bash in the Beach Dave pretty much confirmed Hulk would be the guy based on a reader saying he worked on the set of his movie and Hogan was telling people he would be the guy. Dave interpreted it as Hulk being smart enough to know the invasion angle would be money and wanted to be a part of it. It is true Hulk wasn't 100% convinced until the last minute, Eric wasn't on the pre-PPV Main Event show since he spent all that day making sure Hogan didn't back out. I remember they did some kind of angle on TV where he was kidnapped or something but it got forgotten before the PPV was even over. Also reading Dave's overview of the risks of turning Hogan heel and potentially alienating the kid fanbase that buys all his merch reminded me very much of a certain someone everyone wishes would turn heel today.

So I was reading Observers from the time Hall and Nash jumped to WCW, and in it Dave states the plan for them was basically what ended up happening at Bash at the Beach but with Luger being the third man. Now I'd heard that before, but what was news to me was how it was going to be explained in storyline: the plan was to tie it all the way back to the first Nitro when Lex appeared and imply he was sent from the WWF all along. At this point it's stated the idea was to have Hogan vs Hall on the August PPV, so I wonder what the chain of events was to have it end up going down the way it did.

It's more stuff like the pink NFL gear that sells bazillions and very little goes to the cause. If you donate directly to them it's not too bad, but every company pushing BUY THIS PINK STUFF TO SAVE BOOBS comes off as tacky after a while and it makes it look like the Komen people are whoring themselves.

In wrestling related news, I'd never thought I'd see the day a wrestling company had to apologize to Russians. Somewhere Uncle Ivan sheds a tear.

Is it any better than some viral social media fund and awareness raising drive? Though yes the pink products is over the top, plus Komen has been under fire lately for apparantly not keeping with the liberal pro-choice agenda. At the risk of crossing the "Pro Wrestling Only" line, the issue with Komen has nothing to do with liberal or conservative, it's more along how only a small percent of the sale of pink products actually go toward research, and they've gotten flack for partnering with companies whose products are known carcinogens. Plus a lot of the campaigns come off as companies (like WWE) pandering to women. I'll cop to being too lazy to go do the Googling for you, but I assure you it's more than dirty librulz who have an issue with them.