sek69

I just always assumed the "money in the chase" stuff was mainly pushed in places where the heel champ had some control in the booking and didn't want to be without the title for any extended periods of time. What better way to accomplish that than to convince everyone the real money is in having the face chase him around?

I think the big thing about wrestling discussion is a lot of the "old timers" got burned out and left, and the ones that stayed ended up being annoyed by the new generation that combines not knowing anything with a sometimes profound lack of writing/reading comprehension/social skills. I guess it's the gap between people who came of age on usenet and the early days of the web vs people who started on AOL chatrooms and only speak in "leet". There's nothing that can make you punch a baby in frustration more than talking to someone who types like both their hands are broken and aren't aware that anything happened before 2002. Honestly, where is there for good discussion nowadays? WCMB and KM are largely dead, and DVDVR has some intelligent posters who largely get lost in an ocean of fetishists. The only places where you can find intelligent discussion are at smaller under-the-radar places where wrestling is more of a side dish than the main topic like S&W and CKC (where I lost my posting rights for some reason). I went to the official NWA homepage once and saw they had a board there, it seemed okay at first until I realized anyone even loosely affiliated with the company was posting in kayfabe. People were trying to have serious conversations and you had the NWA-Outer Bumfuck promoter running in like he was in some kind of e-fed that no one else was a part of. Personally I think a lot of it just comes down to people who were around in that mythical 98-02 era just not being into the current stuff as well as there not being any new topics to discuss when it comes to the old stuff. I think it kind of mirrors the wrestling audience in general. Back then Raw and Nitro were pulling in a combined 7 million a week, and now a number half that size for next week's Raw would send WWE over the moon. There's always been a ebb and flow of people discussing things online, but I don't think we're seeing new faces as the rate we used to anymore - nor have we for a long time.

I've said it before, I'm sure, but one of the things I was shocked to discover via WWE 24/7 was how awful early 80s WWF tv is. Not so much match quality, but more so how almost every promotion at the time was just killing them in terms of production. WWF tv just looked like a low rent, cheap-ass cable access type show compared to other territories at the time.

If you actually go back and watch a lot of Bret's matches, you see they really weren't all that different. The only one that really broke the routine was the double turn Austin match.

I actually have to agree with this one, as much as the Bretmaniacs hate to hear it. When you even have Scott Keith busting your balls over your FIVE MOVES OF DOOM~! (in almost the exact order every time) then yes, you do have a repeatable approach. Which wrestler doesn't have a "repeatable approach"? I mean, doesn't everyone kind of have their moveset and their favorite spots? I think Bret just get's shit for it because of Keith's thing. Bret's was pretty recognizable because (like you said) he would often do it in the same order. But most guys kind of have their thing, and use it every match. A lot of wrestlers have repeatable approaches and still are able to mix things up once in a while.

I actually have to agree with this one, as much as the Bretmaniacs hate to hear it. When you even have Scott Keith busting your balls over your FIVE MOVES OF DOOM~! (in almost the exact order every time) then yes, you do have a repeatable approach.

The thing about Von Erich promos is that Kerry was really good until the drugs took hold, but Kevin would always do that thing where he'd grab the mic to cut an ANGRY~! promo on the heel that just wronged him, only to look like he forgot what he was going to say and just spat out some random threatening words. There was a match on a recent WCCW show on demand where it was Kevin vs Kamala and after the match was over (they brawled to the back and Kevin came back out alone) he grabs the house mic and yells something like "KAMALA.........*long pause where he tries to cover up his blanking out with angry pacing around the ring*........YOU GET BACK IN HERE......*pause that seems like dramatic effect for whatever consequence he's about to unleash*...................RIGHT NOW!" The crowd would pop of course, because it's the Von Erichs in 1983 and that's just what they did, but if it was anyone else cutting a promo like that Fritz would have whooped their ass.

I think people had a tendency to overhype the Cena/Umaga match because it was the first time there was something to shove in the faces of those who insist Cena's a horrible wrestler who has to be carried to a good match.

from yesterday's WO update: So basically he wants everyone in wrestling to kill themselves to meet some kind of ideal image wrestlers are supposed to have. Only TNA could end up having the guy who's supposed to be pimping their PPV go on a pro steroid rant and openly discuss match finishes.

On the subject of Von Erichs, my point of contention w/r/t Kevin is can you really consider him a good "worker" when I'm not 100% anyone ever smartened him up to the business to this day. All his stiff matches with Terry Gordy were basically two dudes beating the piss out of each other 3/4ths legit. David may not have been better than his brothers in the ring, but he showed loads more charisma/promo ability than all of them. Hell, the skit on the farm with Jimmy Garvin and Sunshine was more entertaining than anything his brothers did combined. Most of the time Kerry and Kevin marble mouthed their way through their promos. We know now why, but at the time it just made them look like bigger retards.

All I know is that when I was a kid I had all the NWA shows on TBS, the WWF /WCCW/UWF syndicated shows, and Prime Time on USA and I never thought it was too much wrestling.

but then Dave O'Neill, Super Journalist, wouldn't be able to express his disgust at Cena's position on the card by snubbing the main event of a meaningless house show if he just left early like a sane person. He's the walking, talking embodiment of every negative aspect of an internet wrestling fan.

It's way down on the list of Vince Quirks, but has anyone figured out why he seems to get off on breaking up tag teams/separating couples via the draft?

HHH is the biggest example of someone getting over by being at the right place at the right time. The WWF threw everything but the kitchen sink into getting him over and nothing worked. He was entrenched as the second banana in the first incarnation of DX, and then when Shawn's back exploded they did everything to make him the top dog and he still came off as a midcarder who's girlfriend looked like more of a threat than he did. It's only when he was put in matches with guys like Foley, Rock, and Austin that all of a sudden he was seen as a main event player. It's also no coincidence all three of those guys are more than capable of making someone look like a million bucks. By the time those guys weren't around to make him look good, he was already firmly entrenched with Steph and thereby assuring a place at the big boy table 4 life. When it was HHH's turn to make guys look good, he by and large fails to do so and I don't think it's all GLASS CEILING AND POLITIXXXXXXXX, I think he's just not that good of a worker. It's no accident his best matches since 2000 have usually involved some combination of HBK, Cena, and Benoit.

I think a lot of people are guilty of that....

To be fair, you're not likely to say half the things Keller does.

It would seem like the answer almost every time to the question "why is this obviously qualified guy not in the WON HOF" is simply a lack of people pushing his candidacy. Non US/Canadian guys who aren't main eventers need to get someone to really lobby on their behalf, or else they just don't gain any traction. Also does Dave have any retired Japanese wrestlers voting on the HOF? It would seem that would be a hard thing to overcome if the wrestler voting block has no idea who you are.

That was certainly a thing, all of a sudden he's all "so yeah I'm gay and also we have a son now". I mean, good for him on both counts, but from a dude who was so intent on separating work and personal lives it was a surprising thing to read plastered on the internets. However, I do fear that any future criticism of Keller's writing ends up being labeled as gay bashing. Considering how discussion of pro wrestling online tends to go, you know it's going to happen.

Also the endless MSG cards from the 70s-80s, which were interesting to me at first since I didn't have access to the MSG network growing up, but now it's more "Oh Jesus, another collection of 20 minute jobber matches and non-finishes in the main events".

Scoots gets called on his flippy flop regarding Taker: Scooty Poot sez: Of course as usual he no-sells two big points... A. Taker's matches really haven't changed that much other than him adding some (as WWE calls it) "MMA style strikes", which is something Keith generally hates in a pro wres environment. B. When Taker started doing the MMA stuff, he'd regularly mock him for it in his show reviews. Now suddenly it's the reason for his 180 on the guy.

Don't forget there's sometimes subdivisions to the main rules for different countries. Apparently people from Memphis are descended from Mexicans, since piledrivers kill them dead too.

Being technology-impaired is a poor excuse for running ads from a known pedo (I know almost everyone in the biz is scummy to some degree but he was on the news for it for chrissakes). It does kind of make him look bad from a journalistic standpoint when he's spent so much time railing on the drugs/spousal abuse/steroid problems in the major feds but accepts advertisements from a company run by a guy caught in a pedophilia sting. Things like the WWF scandals in the 90s and the Jerry Lawler rumors can always be defended as just that, rumor. Especially when it seems like almost everyone who went public against the WWF ended up being revealed as in it for the money. The RF stuff is pretty undeniable, the only reason he didn't end up in jail over it is because he was caught by a group that is known for being overzealous in their pursuits instead of the police. I guess if the "he wasn't convicted" defense is all anyone can hang their hat on, maybe wrestling fans are more soulless than I gave them credit for. IMO it sounds too much like people who defend OJ or insist Benoit was framed.

Dave definitely has had RF ads after the incident took place, I remember in particular one of Dave's daily updates around Halloween 2007 featured him mentioning picking his kid up from school and seeing all the Rey Misterio masks. Due to unfortunate ad placement, there was one of those animated GIF ads for the latest RF shoot right next to it, which added a layer of unintentional creepy.

It does bear the question I've always wondered, he makes comments like that about (apparently) the WWF scandals, but he still accepts advertising from RF which is something that always bothered me. Dave's always the first guy to get on a soapbox about how rasslin's a scummy business and always will be, yet he gladly lines his pockets with ad cash from a pedo.

The JBL thing was puzzling. I figure he's hurting and all, but he could have had a regular match and just let Rey do all the bumping and have the usual slip-on-a-banana-peel ending. Instead we got a 20 second match and JBL having a tantrum and quitting for his big WM sendoff. I'm surprised JR didn't pull out the "he took his ball and went home" line for the occasion. Also I would bet that the match listing posted above was the scheduled list at one point (Rey mentioned in a radio interview that he was under the belief his match was going to open the show), but WWE has been known to flip out as of late when stuff hits the net.