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dawho5

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Everything posted by dawho5

  1. Nice flow to that show. The Russians are becoming a much more menacing presence.
  2. International Wrestling, September 2nd, 1983 (Taped August 31st, 1983 at the Paul Sauvé Arena, Montreal, QC) 4,000 fans, sellout The opening montage cuts to a shot of Jacques, Sr. welcoming the fans to International Wrestling. Last week’s events are recapped and the camera cuts to the ring where Louis Laurence is slapping hands with fans at ringside as they cheer. Phil Lafon makes his way out to the ring to a better reaction than Laurence, but Jacques, Sr. puts both over as young men with a lot of potential. Opening Match 0:00 - 7:30 Phil Lafon vs. Louis Laurence Lafon takes an early advantage despite some effective punches and elbow smashes from Laurence. Laurence tries working over Lafon’s leg, but Lafon gets out of trouble quickly and starts laying in kicks on Laurence. A running spinkick to Laurence in the corner sends laurence stumbling back to the middle of the ring. Lafon hooks in the cobra clutch in the center of the ring for the win. Phil Lafon wins by submission with a cobra clutch 6:12 Jacques, Sr. runs down the rest of the matches on the card and talks about them briefly as we go to commercial. Commercial Break 7:30 - 17:30 We return from commercial to another shot of Jacques, Sr. as he puts over the previous match as a battle between two rising stars. The camera cuts to the ring and Richard Charland emerges from the curtain wearing his Quebec Heavyweight Title. He gets quite a lot of boos as he rolls into the ring and Jacques, Sr. makes sure the fans watching know that he is a very undeserving champion. Dave Kochen walks down to the ring being cheered by the crowd and slapping hands with more than a few. Jacques, Sr. talks about Kochen’s recent struggles against Charland. Charland ambushes Kochen as he climbs up on the apron and sends him to the floor with a right hand. Dave Kochen vs. Quebec Heavyweight Champion Richard Charland in a title match Kochen struggles to get back in the ring as Charland is not giving him any room to come back in, taking time to respond to the jeers from the crowd each time he sends Kochen back to the floor. Charland’s legs finally are caught by Kochen, who drags him outside and sends him into the guard rail. Referee Pierre Bertrand warns Kochen to not use the ringpost and he instead rolls Charland back in the ring and gets a few nearfalls after taking out his frustrations on the champion. Charland rakes the eyes multiple times to get control of the match back and runs Kochen’s face down the top rope for good measure. Kochen avoids a corner charge on instinct, but he can’t capitalize. Charland and Kochen exchange punches on their knees with Charland rolling out of the ring to avoid further punishment. Dan Johnson runs out and Bertrand is distracted as Charland rams Kochen’s head into the ringpost and rolls the now groggy Kochen back into the ring. A piledriver from Charland gets the three to retain his championship. Richard Charland wins by pinfall with a piledriver 8:05 Jacques, Sr. is fuming about the breach of the rules by Charland as Charland and Johnson celebrate in the ring. Kochen starts to revive, a trickle of blood showing on his forehead before Charland and Johnson rolls him out of the ring and keep celebrating to Jacques, Sr.’s disgust. Commercial Break 17:30 - 35:30 Lou Albano and the Tongan Terrors are in the ring with Jacques, Sr. as we return from break. Jacques, Sr.: Mr. Albano, your charges have been better behaved since their last return to the IWA. Is there any reason for that besides dumb luck? Albano: Hah, funny you should use the word “dumb,” Rougeau. The Tongan Terrors and Albano share a laugh. Jacques, Sr. does not look amused, but says nothing. Albano: You see, I was right! The reason I asked for this time, Rougeau, is because my monsters and I have heard the rumblings of a tournament to be crowned the inaugural Quebec Television Tag Team champions. I just wanted to remind whoever might be in charge of that tournament what happened when we weren’t invited to the tournament to crown new Canadian International Tag Team champions. The crowd boos Albano loudly. Jacques, Sr.: I think we all remember that, Mr. Albano. I see now why you and your “monsters” have been so well-behaved. If you could call it that in any way other than by comparison to their earlier actions. Albano: So you can put two and two together. How nice for you, Rougeau. I just want the fans to know this. These two monsters WILL be your first and ONLY television champions. Just imagine, Rougeau, no matter what we do there is no way that Frank Valois and his cronies can kick my monsters off of television! That means that the fans will be treated to these two monsters from the island of Tonga destroying their opponents week in and week out with impunity! What do you think about that? More loud boos from the crowd. Jacques, Sr.: I think the Can Am Express might have something to say about that. I’ve heard that they are involved in this tournament as well! This changes the crowd’s booing to cheers. Albano: Just when I thought you were learning. These fans I never had any hope for. You think we are worried about the Can Am Express? Just because those two have managed to not get absolutely annihilated by my monsters the last two times they met doesn’t mean they can beat us. These two monsters standing behind me are big, tough, more than capable men who have been DOMINANT since their arrival in the IWA. Do you really think a guy with a dropkick and his little buddy with karate kicks can stop them? Do you think that King Tonga, a man well-versed in the martial arts himself, more experienced, bigger and stronger, doesn’t trump Lafon? Let me tell you something, Lafon! I have heard your threats against me and they will not go unanswered. You are not on my list yet, but you’re close to being right up next to your buddy Brunzell! Just watch yourself before you make me or my monsters angry. Albano sends Tonga John to the back as Jacques, Sr. exits the ring and makes his way back to the announce table. Jim Brunzell slaps hands with the fans on his way to the ring, getting a lot of cheers. Jacques, Sr. puts over Brunzell as a tough, athletic competitor who has been faced with a lot of challenges since arriving in the IWA. Jim Brunzell vs. King Tonga Brunzell tries to get off to a fast start but is cut off by King Tonga headbutts. King Tonga uses his martial arts and brawling to punish Brunzell until the former Hi-Flyer comes back with European uppercuts and starts working the left leg of King Tonga. Tonga comes back with more headbutts, punches and chops, but a missed elbow drop gives Brunzell the opening to go right back to the leg. King Tonga fights his way out of a toe hold with more punches and an eye rake and starts working on Brunzell with nerve holds between headbutts and chops. Brunzell kicks King Tonga’s leg out from under him and goes for the figure four only to have King Tonga kick him to the ropes and blast him with a savate kick. Tonga covers and pulls an almost out Brunzell up at two and a half on Albano’s orders. The thumb is exposed, but Brunzell avoids the thumb spike and spins into a schoolboy for a surprise three count before sliding out of the ring. Jim Brunzell wins by pinfall with a schoolboy 13:47 The crowd goes insane for Brunzell as he celebrates just past the guard rail. Tonga John runs out of the back to ambush Brunzell, but Lafon is close behind him, hitting him in the back with forearms just after he ambushes Brunzell. Tonga John retreats back to the ring after fending off both members of the Can Am Express and the two teams have a standoff as we go to commercial. Commercial Break & Upcoming Events September 3rd, 1983, Paul Sauvé Arena, Montreal, QC Jacques Rougeau & Invader 3 vs. Randy Rose & Gilles “The Fish” Poisson Phil Lafon vs. King Tonga Raymond Rougeau & Invader 1 vs. Dennis Condrey & Mad Dog Lefebvre Jim Brunzell vs. Tonga John Armand Rougeau & Rene Goulet vs. Quebec Heavyweight Champion Richard Charland & Dan Johnson And more! September 5th, 1983, Colisée de Saint-Jean, Saint-Sean-Sur-Richelieu, QC The Can Am Express & Invader 1 vs. The Tongan Terrors & Mad Dog Lefebvre Gino Brito & Tony Parisi vs. Armand Rougeau & Rene Goulet Tony Ricco vs. Gilles “The Fish” Poisson Dave Kochen vs. Goldie Rogers And more! Sep 6th, 1983, Palais des Sports, Granby, QC (2,000, sellout) Canadian International Tag Team Champions The Fabulous Rougeau Brothers & Invader 3 vs. The Midnight Express & Gilles “The Fish” Poisson Jim Brunzell vs. King Tonga Rene Goulet vs. Tonga John And more! September 7th, 1983, Paul Sauvé Arena, Montreal, QC The Can Am Express vs. Mad Dog Lefebvre & Gilles “The Fish” Poisson “The Farmer” Louis Laurence, Dave Kochen & Tony Ricco vs. Goldie Rogers, Quebec Heavyweight Champion Richard Charland & Dan Johnson Armand Rougeau & Rene Goulet vs. The Tongan Terrors And more! September 8th, 1983, Pavillon de la Jeunesse, Quebec City, QC Canadian International Tag Team Champions The Fabulous Rougeau Brothers & the Invaders vs. The Midnight Express, Mad Dog Lefebvre & Gilles “The Fish” Poisson Gino Brito & Tony Parisi vs. “The Farmer” Louis Laurence & Tony Ricco Armand Rougeau & Rene Goulet vs. Quebec Heavyweight Champion Richard Charland & Dan Johnson Dave Kochen vs. Goldie Rogers And more! September 9th, 1983, Colisée de Rimouski, Rimouski, QC Canadian International Tag Team Champions The Fabulous Rougeau Brothers & Invader 1 vs. The Midnight Express & Mad Dog Lefebvre Dave Kochen vs. Goldie Rogers Gino Brito & Tony Parisi vs. The Tongan Terrors Invader 3, Armand Rougeau & Rene Goulet vs. Gilles “The Fish” Poisson, Quebec Heavyweight Champion Richard Charland & Dan Johnson And more! 35:30 - 58:30 We come back from commercial with Jacques, Sr. hyping the debut of a new tag team, Earth & Sky , as two Japanese men in masks are shown. One is wearing a white mask with a dark twister type design on either side and the other a black mask with a stone grey rock design on the face. Eddie Creatchman and the Midnight Express are in the ring with Jacques, Sr. when the camera cuts. The fans are booing all three and taunting them from ringside. The men in the ring seem unaffected by it. Rougeau, Sr.: From what I hear, you and your team are no closer to being number one contenders for the Canadian International Tag Team Titles than you were two weeks ago, Eddie Creatchman. Creatchman: You would be happy about that, Rougeau. You want to keep these men as far away from your boys as you can after the drubbing that Randy Rose gave Jacques last week. The crowd shows Creatchman it’s disapproval. Rougeau, Sr.: I think you overestimate how badly your man beat my son, Eddie Creatchman. And I think it’s time for a deserving team like Gino Brito and Tony Parisi or the Invaders to get a title shot. The crowd cheers. Creatchman: Oh yes, the Invaders. Gino Brito’s new best friends so you would make them out to be some kind of contenders. Guess what, the Midnight Express is the GREATEST tag team in all of wrestling. Whatever you say about Brito or the Invaders or the Can Am Express, they can not compare to these two men behind me. And tonight they are going to prove that. Again. And if Frank Valois and your idiot kids keep ignoring what I’m saying they will regret it. And so will you. Rougeau, Sr.: Nothing you have done thus far has been effective, Eddie Creatchman. What makes you think that things will get any better? Creatchman: You just leave all of that to me, Rougeau. I have everything well in hand, something you should know by now. These men behind me deserve far better than what the IWA is giving them. They are counting on me to get them the match and I KNOW they will make come out champions this time. Do you think I am going to fail these great wrestlers behind me by not getting them the titles they so richly deserve? You can bet that’s not the case. The crowd boos Creatchman and the Midnight Express loudly again as Jacques, Sr. exits the ring and goes back to the announce table. Mad Dog Lefebvre comes out to the ring to loud boos and barks at the crowd. Jacques, Sr. talks about the recent issues between his sons and the Midnight Express as well as the Invaders and Lefebvre & Poisson as The Fabulous Rougeau Brothers and Invader 1 walk to the ring. The Rougeaus are proudly wearing their Canadian International Tag Team Titles. Canadian International Tag Team Champions The Fabulous Rougeau Brothers & Invader 1 vs. The Midnight Express & Mad Dog Lefebvre The Rougeaus bring the fight to the Midnight Express early, all six men in the ring right away before the heels clear out of the ring and talk things over with Creatchman. Condrey faces off with Raymond and ends up getting his arm worked over by the faces for a short while. Condrey reverses a whip by Jacques and decks him on the rebound before stomping away at him. The heels work Jacques over as the crowd voices their disapproval. Jacques makes a fired-up comeback only for Rose and Condrey to stomp a hole in him after illegal man Rose hits Jacques in the back with a few forearms. Head referee Adrian Desbois escorts Rose back to his corner and Condrey tags him in. Rose cuts off another Jacques comeback by kicking the leg out that he had worked on last week. Lefebvre was brought in and he cut off a Jacques comeback with biting and eye rakes before Jacques finally crawled between his legs and tagged in Invader 1. Invader 1 was a house afire when he hit the ring, hitting everything that moved and taking it down. The Midnight Express both get a hold of Invader 1 in the corner and allow Lefebvre to work him over. The heels work on Invader 1, Lefebvre ripping at his mask several times. Invader 1 fights back valiantly, but can’t seem to get over for a tag. When he finally nails Rose with a dropkick and tags Raymond, the place goes nuts. Raymond comes in hot and clears the ring of every opponent but Lefebvre. The two childhood friends brawl across the ring before Raymond slams Lefebvre down and tags in Invader 1. Invader 1 is all over Lefebvre, but Condrey hits the ring and blasts him from behind before knocking both Rougeaus off the apron. Desbois is trying to get Condrey back on the apron as Rose is setting Invader 1 up for Lefebvre’s second rope superplex. Rose knocks Raymond off the apron again as Jacques is still recovering. Desbois again escorts a member of the Midnight Express back to their corner. Invader 1 is fighting back, but Lefebvre rakes the eyes and hits the superplex for the three count on Invader 1. Mad Dog Lefebvre over Invader 1 by pinfall after an assisted second rope superplex 19:36 The show goes off the air with Midnight Express, Creatchman and Lefebvre celebrating in the ring as the crowd boos. Creatchman makes the belt signal around his waist and points at his two charges as Jacques, Sr. Assures the fans that his sons and the Invaders will have their revenge. Dark Matches Pre-Show Tony Parisi defeated Alex Gerrard with a flying senton Tony Ricco defeated Dan Johnson with a crossbody Goldie Rogers defeated Tim Gerrard with a neckbreaker Armand Rougeau defeated Bobby Kay with a sleeper Post-Show Tonga John defeated Rene Goulet with a running big boot Invader 3 defeated Gilles Poisson by disqualification followed by a brawl between the Invaders and Lefebvre & Poisson
  3. Great show! Glad to see Bob get his gold back.
  4. One of Grimmas' Russians is fake too, who would care?
  5. Casey taking on Tonga Kid sounds great! I want to see a joint MAC/MLW show where the Russian teams join forces in a 12-man elimination tag against an all-star Canada/U.S. alliance. That would be a match right there.
  6. I like a slow burn more than rushing to the payoff anyway.
  7. That feud has yet to truly get started. September 1st, 1983, Colisée de Trois-Rivieres, Trois Rivieres, QC (3,400) Dave Kochen defeated Bobby Kay with an abdominal stretch Goldie Rogers defeated Frederic Tremblay with a neckbreaker The Can Am Express defeated the Gerrard Brothers with a dropkick/cobra clutch on Alex Gerrard Jacques Rougeau defeated Rudy Kay with a Quebec crab, the Midnight Express attacked with Raymond Rougeau saving his brother, leading to a standoff Armand Rougeau & Rene Goulet defeated Quebec Heavyweight Champion Richard Charland & Dan Johnson with a flying fist drop/scorpion claw hold on Johnson The Midnight Express defeated Louis Laurence & Tony Ricco with a suplex lift/second rope powerslam on Ricco King Tonga defeated Tony Parisi with a thumb spike Tonga John, Mad Dog Lefebvre & Gilles Poisson defeated Gino Brito & the Invaders with a bearhug/second rope superplex on Invader 1
  8. I wrote four shows over two days about three weekends ago to get to the end of September. I tend to either write everything for TV/big cards or at least all of the matches if I'm not feeling the promos. Then I'll fill in the promos when I am up for it. Then when it is getting towards bedtime or I'm not feeling overly ambitious I'll fill in house show stuff .
  9. The Hayes push begins! Both matches leading up to it look pretty swank as well.
  10. August 30th, 1983, Palais des Sports, Sherbrooke, QC (3,500) Dave Kochen defeated Frederic Tremblay with an abdominal stretch Goldie Rogers defeated Etienne Bergeron Louis Laurence & Tony Ricco deefated the Kay Brothers with a wishbone snap/half crab combo on Rudy Kay Armand Rougeau & Rene Goulet defeated the Gerrard Brothers with a flying fist drop/scorpion claw hold combo on Tim Gerrard The Tongan Terrors & Mad Dog Lefebvre defeated the Can Am Express & Invader 1 with a savate kick/flying headbutt combo on a bloody Lafon, Poisson and Invader 3 ran in sparking a post-match brawl between the four teams Gino Brito & Tony Parisi defeated Quebec Heavyweight Champion Richard Charland & Dan Johnson with a side suplex/flying senton combo on Johnson Canadian International Tag Team Champions The Fabulous Rougeau Brothers & Invader 3 defeated the Midnight Express & Gilles Poisson with a crab/flying knee drop combo on Poisson
  11. dawho5 replied to TravJ1979's topic in The Archives
    I hope Ladd finally gets the respect that he is due around here. What that guy has to put up with! I fully expect Landell to get his revenge in a particularly nasty way. And there is no way Humperdink doesn't have a plan. Frazier is gonna have to fight off the House to get any kind of a real win.
  12. Greg Valentine is Russian?!? Damn that Smirnoff anyway, I knew he was setting Wahoo up. Great payoff that I expect Wahoo to avenge down the line. Main was really good with Martel overcoming the odds to get Saito after all the cheating. I don't know if the tag match overshadows the main or not though. edit: Thinking about it, it's the only way to send the crowd home happy. The two big matches beforehand were heel victories to advance the feud in the long run and build up the Russians I assume for future Martel fodder. It would have been hard to get big pops out of the crowd during the main, but when Martel went over I imagine the reaction would make up for it.
  13. Mainly because Johnny Ace was willing to give the Japanese wrestlers a little offense and let heat build up. And he didn't just lay around in rest holds until it was time for the big finish. Probably helps that Doc had progressed at that point as well.
  14. I am making all of this up as I go. I watched what Montreal footage I could find to get a handle on what the wrestlers with available footage could do. I have no idea what kind of announcer Jacques, Sr. would have been IRL, so I made him into my ideal wrestling announcer. Just so happens that Lance Russell is pretty damn close to my ideal wrestling announcer. Gino Brito, Gilles Poisson, Louis Laurence, Mad Dog Lefebvre, Armand Rougeau & Rene Goulet all have a small amount of available footage that I kind of got keynotes off of for how I want them portrayed. Tony Parisi, Tony Ricco, Dave Kochen (worked AWA as Buddy Lane and in canada as himself as a lower card guy), Dan Johnson (not a Montreal guy, just a filler spot) and Richard Charland are complete and total fabrications on my part. Charland I felt like I needed a chickenshit heel on the roster and he would be a good foil for Laurence as the undercard guys who are moving up to the midcard. One thing I really tried to do is make sure all of my heels felt different. Midnights - badass guys who will cut corners if they have to and are complete assholes, but do not need to cheat to win Tongans - monster heels Mad Dog Lefebvre & Gilles Poisson - wildman brawler & veteran heel who cheats despite his size advantage Charland & Johnson - complete chickenshit heel with his partner to take falls when they are on the losing end/distract/etc. Rogers - arrogant heel One thing I didn't want to do was have a bunch of guys who constantly break the rules and are all the same bad guy. There had to be different characters and motivations going on for all of them so every feud isn't just "this guy cheats and attacks the face and the face has to overcome the odds". That's a great story when done right, but there needs to be variation on it. That is something that really made Buddy Rose stand out to me in the AWA I watched. So many AWA heels were the exact same heel as either the last guy to challenge the face or the guy down the card. Larry Z is a great heel, but it's somewhat less effective when every heel stalls a lot, cheats at every opportunity, etc.
  15. I'm a huge fan of Martel on the whole. The slingshot splash is a thing of beauty for sure. Great show as always, I enjoy the dynamic you two have. It's fitting that the two of you do a tag team-focused podcast where you both bring different stuff to the table and play off of each other so well. It's almost lie it was by design or something.
  16. dawho5 posted a topic in The Archives
    It seems like things are slowing down and I feel like maybe a little more acknowledgement of what has been going right so far might help get things moving a little better. I thought it might be interesting to see what people were thinking about the different promotions, faces, heels, etc. so far. Here's a few of my lists. Promotions: 5. Memphis - I just stared watching a certain well-known Memphis collection and I can't believe how well TravJ has nailed the announcing and general feel of the promotion. 4. Mid-Atlantic - You've got a loaded roster, top-to-bottom good shows and Flair chasing the gold. I'm a big fan of a lot of what you've got going on there. 3. Southeast - Funny that a great tag division PLUS Bob vs. Dutch would show up on my list. 2. Southwest - Great TV and HemisFair shows with what seems like Memphis-style booking. Lots of twists and turns week to week makes it a good read. 1. Georgia - I am loving the tag division and the setup at the top. The 3-way rivalry has so many different things that can happen in addition to the instability of the jake/Adonis faction and it makes for interesting stories. 1 and 2 are neck and neck with Southeast just behind, on a different day I could probably have Georgia at 2 and SW at 1. Honorable mentions would be Stampede, AWA and ICW in no particular order. Heels: 5. Alfred Hayes - This is more because I always chuckle at how he is written as if Parv were playing him in a movie about wrestling. 4. Terry Funk - He'd be higher if I felt like I could get attached to him in any way. 3. Ernie Ladd - I hope that Lawler gets what's coming to him! 2. Tully Blanchard - I'm a big Tully fan to begin with an the way he's being used seems avsolutely perfect. 1. Jake Roberts - Technically a tweener now, but I think he still counts. Loving everything about him so far. 1 and 2 again are up in the air. Honorable mentions to Heenan, Bock and DiBiase. Also Lanny Poffo and Jim Holliday Faces: 5. Rick Martel - He's gonna be something big in the capable hands of Jack Tunney. After he deals with the Japanese and the Russians of course. 4. Ric Flair - Flair for the gold is just as great in this universe. 3. Hulk Hogan - Hogan as the ass-kicking brawler is pretty awesome. Japan mode forever. 2. Bob Armstrong - Wild brawls with Dutch all over the territory have got to be making some money. 1. Butch Reed - Part of one of my favorite feuds so far and a big part of Georgia's success. Honorable mentions are Kevin & Kerry von Erich, Lawler, the Freebirds, and the RnR Express. Feuds: 5. Tokyo Hurricanes vs. the British Bulldogs - It's got to be a huge shock that I would love a workrate tag team feud. 4. Road Warriors vs. the AWA locker room - Great idea for an angle and again, tag team, shocking. 3. Bob Armstrong vs. Dutch Mantell - As referenced above, awesome stuff here. 2. Killer Khan vs. the holdover babyfaces from Southwest - Great feud that led to incredible main event matches. 1. GCW three way feud - I am loving this booking to death and I hope it goes on for a good long while. Honorable mentions are big badass dudes vs. Buck Zumhofe, Lanny vs. Savage, The Russians vs. Freebirds, Martel vs. the world, Backlund vs. Heenan and crew, and Dick the Bruiser vs. King King Bundy. Matches: 5. Martel vs. Slaughter, Canada Cup final 4. Flair vs. Funk, Summertime Blues 3. Buzz Sawyer vs. Tommy Rich LLT Cage Match 2. Killer Khan vs. Bob Sweetan 1. Killer Khan vs. Scott Casey Honorable mentions would get way too long here. I'm sure we all have things we like to rate and try to rank, so don't feel like anything I posted is the limit of what categories could be used.
  17. It would be easier if I knew who half of the active wrestlers in 83 were, but I'm slowly catching up on things. Seems like most are running short of time or just got a bit burnt out. I imagine it helps more than a little when other people read and comment to keep things moving. When you feel like you're just writing for yourself it is hard to keep it up.
  18. Stan needs to keep his head on straight instead of going after the manager. I like how you progressed the Mansfield/Welch feud with all the Fuller stuff still going on and transitioned right back to it. Duggan overcoming Kaissie's cheating right after dispatching Khan is a nice way to set him up as a big deal off the bat.
  19. Bob is going to start feeling the effects of all those piledrivers soon.
  20. That main looks like it would be a great tag.
  21. Martel has his work cut out for him in Maple Leaf Gardens. Hopefully whoever is reffing that one tosses Ventura early. Somebody is gonna use Deaton's boot against him soon and it's gonna be a nice payoff.
  22. Good TV, moves a few things forward with an Andre match to boot.
  23. dawho5 replied to Grimmas's topic in Nominees
    Taue was great in big matches during his NOAH run. I think I am in the same boat as jdw on Kobashi. At a certain point he needed to not be the overly emotional underdog who had to kill his opponent with everything he had in order to get the win. In 1993 it was an incredible thing to watch but it got old.

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