Laz

I hope TK gets it because we know that AEW would put plans into motion to utilize it quickly. The Gabe years are a golden era to the modern fan, where the modern style was codified. They're working on a streaming service of some sort, last I heard, and debuting it with AEW footage as well as Ring of Honor classics would be an instant buy-in for a good chunk of fans.

To get away from the moral discussions (though bravo to all for handling it with much more tact than I'm used to seeing), the entire ROH library is up for sale and not just the Sinclair era. https://www.wrestlinginc.com/news/2021/10/updates-on-ring-of-honor-contracts-possibly-bringing-in-gcw-talent/

I don't think that seems silly. I regularly say that ROH in 2006 is my favorite year for a product ever, and so much of that is because the show encapsulated everything I loved about pro wrestling, and all without feeling derivative. Back then, where could you turn to see in-ring action you couldn't get anywhere else? ROH. What company had been delivering on its programs having conclusions and limiting the nonsense that plagued Monday nights? ROH. Where could you see a no-roped barbed wire deathmatch on the same card as a technical wrestling clinic? ROH. It says something that so many of the industry's biggest names over the last decade spent a good chunk of the 00s in ROH. Punk, Bryan, Joe, Styles, Rollins, Owens, Zayn... The shows were great even into the end of the Gabe era, but if I could pinpoint one specific thing that began the downfall, it would be, as @strobogo said, the HDNet era. The shows were great as bi-weekly events, allowing the core talent to go out there and bust ass each show, allowing the breathing room for stories and feuds to build and build. Swapping to a weekly presentation required a fundamental reworking of the company's approach to booking, one that never quite worked in that format. It wasn't "special" anymore, if that makes sense, and it was hammered home by the booking just getting worse and worse until I'm supposed to think of Eddie Edwards as a shooter. Again, as said, that was over a decade ago. And the shows have just never recovered. The magic was gone. If this is the end, then I'll remember those glorious early years where the company redefined what American pro wrestling could be, when a platform with a large reach was given to hungry talent looking to make their mark.

I remember Bower most for being a tool when he was made a mod on the Smarks/TSM forums, but at least he did some good.

Caught it yesterday (thank you, @Blehschmidt). There wasn't much new to me being brought up (though I somehow didn't know Kaos was Supreme's nephew), but it was worth it to expose Rob Black as the subhuman shitstain he is. I hope that we get some actual evidence that Rob was behind the Messiah attack and he gets sent to a federal penitentiary. Or that somebody who works his renewed XPW attempt knocks him down a few (hundred) pegs. Jessica Darlin came off really well, too. She was just kinda there in XPW, from what I remember, but her disillusionment with everything Rob Black really shines through, even if she admits she had a blast for a while. One thing I would've liked, though, would've been how Black transitioned from his "feud" with Heyman/ECW to the very real rivalry with Zandig/CZW, so much so that Justice Pain received death threats for leaving CZW and working for XPW. This was also when Shane Douglas took over as booker and put together some actually good shows, and XPW signed an exclusivity deal with the ECW Arena. Maybe not integral to the story being told, but this was all happening right around when the federal obscenity investigations were occurring, so it added to the "Rob Black is a shithead" story because he really did abandon the talent he convinced to kill themselves for him the moment things got hot.

Messiah was, far and wide, the only positive about XPW in terms of the product. I may have had a soft spot for Johnny Webb and Homeless Jimmy, but Messiah was the only one I thought could've gone places. I need to find a way to watch this ep. It's been the one I've wanted since the show started.

Man, I had a set for CotG back in the day, right alongside my IWA gazettes from the two leagues I was in. Then efeds happened and they were free. Is that Filsinger Online thing worthwhile?

The fans' backlash against Roman can be summarized in two key moments. 1. Rumble '15. Bryan was the obvious fan favorite, we've all said this, blah blah blah. But, more egregiously... 2. "Sufferin' succotash." That one moment became such a meme that exemplified to the fanbase that Roman wouldn't be the conquering bad MF that they wanted but just another goody two-shoes like Cena.

90s had peak Bret, peak Austin, peak HBK, and peak Foley. It has the greatest Rumble ever. It has two of the earliest widespread examples of the Ladder match, and both are great. That's my answer.

Piper as a face and Hogan as a heel is what made me watch WCW in the first place, since they were early childhood favorites. Even though I can rewatch that stuff and agree that it's bad? Piper is still a top 5 for me.

That's on par with most efed graphics circa 2005. Which means it's funny in multiple ways.

Probably "if something is horrible then why accept a settlement," which is a very common mentality. It's an ignorant take, agreed, but it's not "you shouldn't have a job anymore" ignorant.

I was going to share this in the DSOTR thread, because XPW, but it doesn't fit the current serious talks about the Flair incident. Somebody at another board shared that Jon Barber's XPW book, Bleeding Was Only Half the Job, has been released posthumously. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B099TL5Z3Z

Aren't the worst stories about RVD basically just "somebody was mouthing off and RVD punched them"? He never really came across as anything grander than an opinionated ass, and I think calling out people for this kind of thing makes him seem that much better. I won't condemn Dreamer, but holy shit he needs to learn how to shut his fucking mouth. Even a simple "I only saw him doing the helicopter" would've allowed him to save some face instead of just digging himself deeper and deeper the more he tries to defend somebody's shitty assault.

It's also a wise career move, because there's literally nothing about his look, presence, or in-ring work that would make him anything but a job guy on the main roster. He at least gets to show he can "go" in NXT, in the event that he isn't offered a new deal when his current one expires, while a main show run would result in a lot of travel for nothing, and that helps future bookings elsewhere.

Well, Spike's one of the most underrated workers of that era, so...

That's the one thing I'll give DBZ, really. Their heels were built up amazingly...but it all required the audience to buy into the faces (Goku et al). "The chase" should be the hero overcoming obstacles, not just the villains constantly besting them. It's like people just think Austin/McMahon drawing all the money in the world, or how Sting and DDP were the most over faces against the nWo, barely happened. The heels create the obstacles and the heroes fight back. Gotta give the good guy a win now and then, even if it's just them fighting off the bad guys for a night.

Empire Records era LaPaglia is pretty close to late 80s Keanu.

He'll avoid any possibility of getting sued, so he'll be Page's new buddy, Hangman Rotunda.

I would make it a point to watch every single week if they could guarantee a shoot headbutt into Omega's face.

I'm with Rah on this one. At least Mr. Pogo would use his sickle to gash because he was a sadistic fuck, really working it while letting the "victim" gig between slashes. This was just sorta business exposing and further proves that the only GCW deathmatch workers who really have a clue have been Nick Gage and...well, anybody else that was big in CZW ~20 years ago.

Deathmatch stuff only works for me when it's still a wrestling match that just so happens to involve a lot of blood, stunts, and whatnot. I think US deathmatches peaked around 2006/2007 when the focus became more about heated brawls with plunder and insane highspots than when it was before (weedwhackers and 10,000 lighttubes) or after (glass, glass, and more glass). Too much of it spot, stall, spot, stall, etc. until a finish that comes off as deflated because of the carnage that came before. I didn't see the incident that sparked this, nor do I really care to (I think GCW, as a promotion, is kinda shit), but knives and sickles and whatnot just screams "we're out of ideas." If the point of pro wrestling is to create a hyper-realistic world where athletes are so well-trained and tough that they can regularly compete in this form of barbarism, then introducing something that could happen in a pub parking lot after one drink too many just doesn't cut the mustard. The odd dichotomy, though, is that I don't think a broken lighttube being used in that manner would've been out of place, nor do I think it would've drawn this kind of (negative) attention. As it is, I just end up thinking less of everybody involved as performers, because "I hate him so much I'm going to use a pocket knife to slash his belly" screams creative malaise. Why not just stab the motherfucker if you hate him that much? Or go for his face? In regards to MoS's aversion to forks, though, I don't mind forks being used, mainly because there's a history of them being easily concealed weapons that are so "out there" that the people who use them are seen as even more dangerous for taking such a common tool and making it into a weapon. Knives just come off as cheap.

It's weird that this week was seen as a downer, because I watched most of the first half live and enjoyed it more than I've enjoyed anything AEW in nearly a year.

I'm going to look for the clip, but I've seen a 'rana pulled off in an amateur wrestling match before. (This obviously isn't it, but is relevant)