elliott

I think if we had a real picture of the Texas Outlaws he'd be a lock. BUt we don't and he ends up on the borderline for me. The Superstar Graham matches are so good that I feel like I almost have to at least think about him for that alone since Graham was such a dogshit worker. The best promo ever. Top 5 announcer too.

I always loved the 2000-01 Low-Ki vs Homicide matches. How do those look 20 years later? I feel like I watched a couple during 2016 and they were pretty awesome still.

Right but Fujiwara was a case of people looking backwards 10-20 years at someone they had never seen before. Kingston is a contemporary people were able to watch in real time. There are some Kingston matches on the old Goodhelmet MOTYC comps but "he's one of the best of the last 15 years" isn't something I'd seen until the last couple of years. And this isn't like a criticism of Kingston or the people propping him up or an attempt to push back. Its merely an observation. Hell based on what everyone says about him, he sounds like my kinda guy as far as modern wrestlers go.

I mean its not really about Segunda Caida. Phil said in the thread that he thinks Kingston was best in the world for the past 5 years. That's all post GWE 2016. What I find interesting are comments like "he was great for 15 years" or "top 10 US workers of the 2010s" when there was all of 3 posts about Kingston the last time around.

Its interesting after such little discussion of him leading up to 2016 that several people are saying he's been one of the best around for 15 years. It reminds me of the AJ STyles discussions during the 2016 project.

You're welcome, Rah. Fuerza is steadily climbing the more I watch. I had him penciled into my top 50 but he's even better than I thought. All of the classic 80s babyfaces: Steamboat, Martel, Tito are falling. I've got room for Ricky Morton towards the top end of the list for 80s babyfaces. But I think those other dudes are gonna take a tumble.

Dusty snuck on the last list at 92. Not much discussion about him. What do people think about Dusty as a candidate this time around?

I figure we're several months into the project so we could go for a Stock Rising & Stock Falling thread. Who's rising up your list, who is falling? Any surprising top 10 contenders? Anyone you initially viewed as an all time great that you're starting to question?

There's another universe where Vince screwed Shawn, Bret stayed and Owen ended up with Stephanie.

care to elaborate? I don't think anyone would argue Austin was better after the Blondes because of Pillman's injuries. But early 90s Brian Pillman was frigging awesome.

Low Ki is a great call for 2001

Mexico was loaded in 2001.

I think there's a difference between "Guy who could carry a promotion in the future" and "Best guy right now." Austin & Dustin being the two guys to carry WCW into the future was something you'd hear about pre-Hogan WCW but I've never seen someone say Austin was the best wrestler in the US in 93/94. Its an interesting opinion. I've certainly never thought it but it makes me wanna watch some WCW stuff.

Off the top of my head I feel like my 93-99 year by year best in the US would be something like: 93 - Vader, Doink, Terry Funk, Sabu, Bret, Waltman 94- Bret, Foley, Sabu, Terry Funk, Owen, Waltman, Regal, Dustin, Vader 95- Bret, Eddy Guerrero, kinda blanking on 95 right now but I feel good about Bret there and Austin only works half the year anyway. 96 - Rey all the Way! Would also listen to arguments for Shawn, Psicosis, Foley, Sabu, Scorpio, Austin and Benoit but I'm not watching those matches. 97 - I'd give the nod to Bret because of the neck break. I also think Funk has a hell of a year until he retires. He's a jerk and we all hate him but this is probably my favorite HBK year as a singles performer. Eddy Guerrero is another strong pick. I think this is the first time Austin is really in the conversation. 98 - Wouldn't disagree with Austin as the pick Jan - June 99 - I haven't watched Jan-June 1999 WWF since Jan-June 1999. So probably AUstin? I guess Foley would be the big competition in WWF. Other than that Tajiri.

Would you say that's the case for individual years or are you strictly speaking the totality?

Spring of 92? Damn. That's early.

So like 94-99?

What do you think was Austin's best year? What is the closest Austin ever got to being the "Best" wrestler in the world?

3 people have voted and Matt Borne is winning. Love yall. Watch this AMAZING promo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3z3y_2kFtQ

I said it. Dibiase is a great textbook, paint by the numbers and within the lines wrestler. A great athlete you could teach to do anything and then he could go out and replicate it. But I see him as about as inside the box as it gets. He's not a real critical deep thinker and you really need a thinking on their feet and outside of the box sort of performer to pull off something like Evil Doink. I think if you erase the Evil Doink run its much easier to say Dibiase is better and I wouldn't argue for Borne in those circumstances. Its what he was able to show as Doink that pushes him to another level. Dibiase gets all the fill in the blanks shit right on the test but his essays are missing something special even if they're technically correct. Borne leaves some of the blanks empty but then writes this profound paper from a unique POV that nobody else could really replicate and you ask him to read it aloud in front of the class and everyone goes "WHOA HE WROTE THAT?"

Dav'oh, it might be fair to say that Tamura & Han were the greatest pro-wrestlers of their era because they were able to truly modernize what the early greats were doing. The Tamura vs Kohsaka 6/27/98 masterpiece takes place a day before Mankind vs Undertaker Hell in a Cell. What is closer to Thesz vs Gagne? You should watch some early UWF1.0 and see what they're up to. Its really fun. Sayama is doing flying headbutts and tombstones. It reminded me a little of BattlArts. Its very much pro-wrestling.

I'm voting for Tamura, Volk Han and Andy Kaufman. They were all great pro wrestlers.

Top 10!

Shane McMahon, Edge, Randy Orton, HHH, Seth Rollins, The Fiend, Kane, Dolph Ziggler

Shit. That list starts with high card WWE Publicly Traded Company era guys.