El-P

I don't give a flying fuck about anyone liking what I like or not. I guess NWA Powerr is an interesting topic to me for several reasons (the whole "retromania" issue is something that is quite fascinating in general, not just in pro-wrestling), and the thread is always quite active so I guess there's more material for discussion than say, on the MLW and IMPACT threads in which I'm quite active too usually. The day NWA Powerr delivers something I will love (and who knows, like I said I was about to quit MLW several times and then their big show was terrific and I loved it), be sure I will talk about it too.

I have a hard time with this mentality. I explained why in endless details in this very thread. To me it doesn't work because just like you said, it's about aesthetics only. It's cosmetic. And that's why it's empty to me. The fact this show got way more traction that MLW, which is also on Youtube and available to everyone, speaks volume about how a simple cosmetic choice can create a positive bias for a product which, overall, really isn't very good. Yeah, the promos are good because they have a bunch of really strong talkers, but the wrestling has been mostly pure nothingness because of the cosmetic choice of doing super short matches. The reason the old territory shows were doing super short matches in a studio setting is because they were selling house shows. That was the necessity of the business model and had nothing to do with the belief that "Oh, short match and squashes are what makes a good pro-wrestling show". NWA Powerr isn't selling house shows, so they are replicating something totally out of context and so the cosmetics end up weighing more than the actual content of the show. What's left if most of the wrestlers, matches and angles aren't very good/cool ? Cosmetic. Aesthetics. The difference with Lucha Underground is that Lucha Underground was basically studio wrestling too, but with a modern, hell, you can argue even avant-garde approach with the entire vignette stuff being unseen by the announcers, as the whole thing was basically its own universe. The cosmetic was super important, but the matches were also presenting something looking forward, whatever people thought about it. And yet, it was studio-wrestling, quite literally.. So yeah, I agree there's a place for a cool, different kind of presentation, hell it's even needed. But this hasn't been it, because NWA Powerr has been a clear case of the cosmetics smothering the entire product, instead of just giving you that old-school style with a twist. I would watch a vaporwave studio wrestling show every week. Hell, I'd watch IPWF (the fake IMPACT early 80's promotion) every week. Yeah,it's pastiche, but at least it is funny and it is a more heartfelt and smart tribute to territory wrestling that Powerr has been to me. Wait, what was that ? FTR, Momma Storm is Judy Bagwell level lame. No idea why anyone thinks it's cool. A 50 year old guy talking about his "momma" sounds dumb as fuck. There's a George Carlin quote about that somewhere...

Not even close. Okada. Defined the state of the art pro-wrestling of the decade; took the torch passed on by Tanahashi and kept on rebuilding NJPW into a hot promotion (the only hot promotion in Japan, really). Reigns has been the rejected chosen one of a slowly crumbling down (in term of interest and attendance) WWE. So there.

So, last week meant zilch. Interesting. About all those wacky cult gimmicks, you know what, I for one love the fact AEW already has moved clear away from "sports oriented" approach and embraces the sillier aspect of pro-wrestling. More Lucha Undergound/BTE, less Mid-South fetish ! Yay !

So, basically, people were hyped about a LEGO studio setting and a Dokken song.

I only find it ironic that after years and years and years the old TNA (not the IMPACT of Callis/D'Amore) was the laughing stock of the pro-wrestling landscape, got no credit whatsoever, most of every workers who where TNA-originals (or affiliated) were considered like jokes (see how a super solid worker like Robert Roode got shit on by most when he got to NXT), but put them in a LEGO Georgia Territory Studio and have them feud on top of the card and all of a sudden it's cool and old-school. ALdis vs Storm is old-school all-right. Old-school TNA from the early to mid 2010's. The rest is dressing up. I for one have no issue with this, hell I've probably spent more time than anyone talking about old TNA on this board, but the idea that NWA Powerr is a fresh product because it "looks" like an old territory show when they deliver stuff like Eli Drake vs Ken Anderson is kinda, yeah, funny to me. Also, the insane amount of TV time devoted to a guy like Aron Stevens reeks of old TNA. Take a guy who was a joke act in WWE and push him at the US title level. Same for the new announcer, who's immediately referred to by his old WWE gimmick. Because it's funny and ironic that *now*, these are are cool, apparently, when for the last ten years any of them would have been loledtna out of any conversation. I mean, Nick "Brutus Magnus" Aldis and James "Beer Mooney" Storm. Old TNA failures, that's how these guy would be refered of they showed up on NXT I would believe (unfairly, but that's how it goes). Please, let's not make that an AEW vs NWA thingy because it's not at all. I shit on what I find shitty about NWA Powerr because I actually followed the promotion for the last two months, much like I have blasted whatever I have found shitty on MLW for the last year and a half (and I have found tons of shitty stuff on MLW, and also things that I like). And like I said about MLW, hey maybe NWA will turn things around, but to me they have to change quite a bit of stuff on those seconds tapings. NWA isn't ROH yet to me, I'm still at least interested in checking them out (for how long, no idea). And also, if we're perfectly honest, if AEW fails and collapse, it will be a very bad thing for the pro-wrestling landscape and its workers. If NWA Powerr disappears, it will barely be a blip on the radar, as it's not exactly on the same range. (it's not even on the same range with LU at the end, with guys like Fenix & Penta, Cage, Kross, Hijo del Fantasma etc… signed to those ridiculous contracts)

Apart from Matt Taven, who has zero hype whatsoever and whose reign has totally tanked the promotion anyway (in his case, I wonder why ROH would want to keep him) and the Briscoes for obvious reasons, I dunno why anyone with a profile would want to stay in ROH while WWE and AEW are in a war for talent. Especially NXT signing anyone just for them not to show up in AEW. It will not last forever. Scurll staying in ROH now makes no sense. He's gonna waste years of his career in a dying promotion with no guarantee of being a sought after commodity in a few years (and will AEW will even be a factor then, no one knows, so that's another risk). Right now, he could rule NXT feuding against Adam Cole or be a big name in AEW. Same goes for guys like PCO (whom I guess would love to get another shot at making it in WWE), Brody King (AEW badly needs a guy like him) and Rush (who can do whatever the hell he wants). And whatever side on the fence they go will only improve their profile. Staying in ROH makes them afterthoughts at best.

They ran the Rock'n'Roll Express match, when it leads to nothing concrete on the PPV. Why could they not ran the three-way since it does determine the PPV main event ? Also, Storm lost the US title, so why winning some three-way would make him the n°1 contender when the US champ, by NWA rules, is the n°1 contender ? None of this makes any sense.

That's a pretty great description. But that's actually a great heel gimmick. Also, his face (not the haircut) really reminds me of an old friend, who's an old college cinema teacher and intellectual. So there's a bit of odd cognitive dissonance whenever I watch Jimmy Havoc.

I can totally relate to that. I mentioned on the JR Podcast thread that basically the Lawler episode reminded me that most of Lawler's WWE stint had been awful. I only appreciated the first Bret Hart feud from 1993 way after the fact, at the time, not having any notion of who Lawler was (and watching the show in French, without Lawler's announcing), "slightly pudgy commentator" was exactly how Lawler came off to me. I probably wouldn't be so hard on Lawler from 95-97, but I definitely agree he was far removed from Heenan or Ventura, hell, even Heenan on Nitro was much better in getting the NWO angle over. And yeah, "puppies" is pretty much his legacy from the Attitude Era. When you add the fact he had "legal issues" as they said on the aforementioned podcast for allegedly raping 16 years old girls and his infamous taste for younger women in general, that has aged horribly (and honestly was already awful and annoying as fuck back then). Lawles is definitely an overrated figure in pro-wrestling folklore (and yeah, I mean overrated in general, I never ever bought into the post-DVDVR Memphis set narrative of Lawler being this all-time great worker either, I debated for countless hours about this back then; I settled on "very good", which came off as an insult to the Memphis-heads) and honestly a shady character that is getting multiple passes where most people would not. Maybe that's because he throws a great punch.

I forgot that one. He may very well be excellent in his role, but the way he was introduced reeked of old TNA, immediately refering to his WWE character. "We know who that is…" I mean, of all the people you could get, you had to pick some clear cut 00' WWE reject and not someone fresh from the indies or a surprising old-timer. Yeah, total TNA feel. That being said, maybe he'll be great in his role, so hopefully it works. I do hope their next set of tapings will follow a different pattern, because that "first season" really wasn't good.

Jimmy Havoc stapling the fines he gets for stapling people on his opponents' forehead is quite a smart and funny idea. I like the fact he referred to him getting drunk at a bar too. Also, he guy can actually work, as showed by this good little match with Cutler. Between this and some ridiculous stuff on MLW, I'm warming up slowly but surely to Jimmy... I guess Nyla didn't get the memo about not referring to the Perfect Ten. She's pretty good though, but nowhere near Spears last week. Santana & Ortiz vs Jurassik Express was really good. Marko shined in that one (not even mentioning the dart-style canadian destroyer during the post-match). The one thing with P&P is that they probably are better suited as babyfaces (Ortiz especially as that goofy babyface charisma). Guevarra on the other hand can't be likable, ever, so just hanging on with him balances things. They were quite funny along Hager on this week's BTE (which was Being the Inner Circle). Tony & Dasha work quite well together hosting this show BTW.

Considering how this entire series turned out in term of actual matches and booking, the Corny debacle really ends up being a smokescreen to hide the fact this promotion is simply not very good. The top of the PPV card kinda looks like a TNA tribute card : Aldis vs Storm (old TNA champs). Drake vs Anderson (TNA dream match of guys who act like Rock/Austin). And a WWE reject comedy guy who is getting way more time than he should (TNA staple) and gets a title match against Cabana (and people complained about comedy wrestling in AEW ?). And then, 60+ years old Rock'n Roll Express as tag champs. Don't get me wrong, I popped hard for Ricky Morton doing a cool spot at Spring Break (thanks Janela) and on AEW TV & PPV. But there's a difference between do a cool little match on a crazy indie show and be your actual tag team champions in 2019, in the times of the Young Bucks, Lucha Bros, Revival, Undisputed Era and whatnot. I kinda hate to be that guy, the in the end, there's nothing there but nostalgia pop and retromania. For the record, the title match was also a complete nothing match, so you didn't even get the real fun of an actual surprisingly good match in 2019 like they had against the Briscoes or LAX (hell, or even that fun match I saw from a Bar Wrestling show). It's not old-school, it's just old. And as far as Kamille go, the booking has also been a smokescreen of pseudo mystery, as in a matter of 8 weeks, they haven't made a actual understandable storyline out of it. IMPACT has been my favorite promotion for the last 18 months (not counting AEW since it's so new), mostly because they make the most out of everything they got and they know how to build feuds that make sense and tell stories, even if it's ridiculous ones (like Ace Austin vs Eddie Edwards, which was total camp). In 8 weeks, it doesn't seem so hard to actually build to a PPV with simple storyline advancement every episode. They pretty much have done zilch in that respect, while at the same time delivering nothing in term of actual good matches (I can think of one or two decent ones) because of their "old-school studio wrestling format" which puts all the emphasis on promos and quickies. So in the end, you get the worst of both worlds : no really fun matches that you get on MLW at times (despite their dubious at best booking) for instance, and no good booking either, with stuff like James Storm losing his US championship yet getting the title shot, and matches and stips thrown in seemingly from nowhere on the last two episodes, one of which being a recap show. So yeah. When I think we won't ever have a Lucha Underground season 5 but this promotion will go on (under what format, I have no idea, I can't see them doing any good PPV numbers nor keeping any hype after the last few weeks), well, let's say the pro-wrestling landscape is not better for it. I may still keep on checking out what they do after the PPV (and hey, I was about to drop MLW from my watch-list and then they delivered one of the most fun show of the year to me), but at this point, I simply wish some of their talented people will end up somewhere else where they can shine eventually.

Funny that some years after the #womensevolution, the only notable angle they are running in late 2019 is all about a women getting totally sexually objectified and painted as a complete slut. (and for those who wonder, I do follow the angle on Youtube, it's fascinatingly terrible)

Eddie Gilbert was a small guy who had a great mind for new ideas. He was instrumental in kicking off garbage wrestling cult matches with Cactus Jack in the Phillie area before ECW, and then was instrumental in putting ECW on the map. He had a super cool act with his hot-as-fuck and great valet Missy Hyatt. He was deemed "too small" by old-school mentality. Joey Janela is a small guy who has a great mind for new ideas. He's made his name in cult garbage matches and was successful in promoting some of the most crazy and innovative indy shows at Mania week-ends for the last few years. He had a super cool act with his hot-as-fuck and great valet Penelope Fort. He's deemed "too small" by old-school mentality.

No, but a valet leaving a wrestler to go with another wrestler is pro-wrestling angle 101. This is Missy Hyatt leaving John Tatum for Eddie Gilbert (and now that I think of it, you can definitely make an analogy between Eddie Gilbert and Joey Janela too). I hope they do work that angle at some point. Ford is super fun as a valet who can bump and do cool shit.

That angle reeks of Russo 1999, with the only clear heel in the whole trio being the woman. It's a more developped rehash of Dustin/Terri/Val.

So, Kylie Rae was at Bar Wrestling last show and she looked to have a blast. Hopefully IMPACT signs her.

I'm wondering if this is even possible in today's context. These three became stars because of the power of TV. They were TV stars. Today, are teenagers even watching TV anymore ? I have a 16 years old nephew, he's always watching stuff on Youtube on his phone, he very seldom watches TV I believe. The way of consumption of entertainment has changed a lot in the 15/10 last years for the new generation. It's not a wonder why WWE's demographic is so old. Everything seems to be more scattered than ever before, there's not the TV that is getting all the families & friends together around one program. In that context, I don't see how it's clear what the next big thing in pro-wrestling could be. Pro-wrestling exploded thanks to television. It had to evolved from the kayfabe era to a form of self-consciousness to keep the interest of new fans alive, which means more toward performance art with the focus on matches-for-their-own-sake as the main point of drawing interesting. Which is why also real feats (of strength, athleticism, stiffness, stunts or comedy) have become way more prevalent. Whereas the perception of pro-wrestling has never leaned more toward the fact it's a performance (hence, "fake" from the old standpoint of "hey, this is a sport"), the actual performances have never been more real, and as much as people like to make fun of "movez" and "flippity flips", pro-wrestling has never been a more difficult task in term of actual athleticism and in-ring talent (and so it is an actual sport now way more than ever before). In a way, pro-wrestling has never been more real, which is why what passed for "realistic selling" (which really wasn't realistic at all when you think of it more than three seconds) is now taking a backseat to the actual, real, extremely arduous kind of action that is becoming the meat and bones of pro-wrestling today. Maybe it's just a necessity out of an entire context evolving. Anyway, just ranting...

That's really a dumb as fuck argument though. But yeah, you're probably right. Which really paints a dire picture of pro-wrestling fans average intelligence (well human beings maybe). "Hey, the company I like is better because more people watch it bro."

There is that, yes. It's funny because for years and years now we've heard from WWE fanboys how ratings never mattered less and how the ratings going down and down and down didn't mean shit because people were streaming and watching Youtube and how social medias actually were the real indicators. Sure… The one thing that is for sure : there isn't gonna be a boom period. On the contrary, the market seems saturated (thanks for nothing WWE). The fact AEW exists is awesome. But pro-wrestling isn't hot. That being said, I would probably take a context where AEW can exist while pro-wrestling isn't too hot over the Attitude Era when WCW and ECW went to hell while WWF became unwatchable despite being the hottest its even been. If AEW can stay healthy, that's all I ask. And I mean, IMPACT is still on the air, so...

The thing is, I never understood the fascination of pro-wrestling fans with ratings. I mean, do you know any other kind of entertainment where people care about whether the show they watch is doing big ratings or bigger ratings than the program on the opposing channel or whatever ? I mean, yeah, it's fun for the whole "wrestling war" narrative, but honestly, I was shocked the first week when AEW trumped NXT. WWE is such a huge machine with unlimited budget and huge-ass roster of talent, there's no way AEW should even win, really. As far as I go, I'm fine with AEW losing in the ratings every week as long as they are existing and providing ME with a pro-wrestling show I really enjoy. For the business as a whole (workers, mostly), it's better for AEW to be really successful of course.

Big ass drop for AEW. Then again, their target audience is younger, so, maybe the DVRed the thing this week while getting wasted at the bar. Maybe NXT won because no Mauro means people like me who can't stand him watched the show his week. Anyway, gotta love WWE fanboys already shouting "AEW is dead" and stuff...

To me the rankings will make more sense and will be useful for storyline purpose after a few months when the win/loss records will be deeper. That is, if they keep both of those items.

I for one love Arn's soft tone voice. I could listen to him talk for hours.