Everything posted by Matt D
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Your own Criteria
Patterns over time leading to a "how well does someone understand pro wrestling and can he transfer that understanding into the ideal performance for the situation that he is in." If it means he's in a situation to have a great match, he can have a great match. If it means that he can get over in a three minute squash match, he can do that. If it means that he can put over an opponent without taking too much of the match, he can (and will) do that. It encompasses tag matches, house shows, TV tapings, dark matches, everything under the sun. You can learn almost as much from watching four or five tv squashes as you do from a 35 minute classic, and more than that, you learn different things. It's an approach that takes a lot of work, but it's a holistic one, a whole career one. It also only judges a wrestler for the matches he has and it doesn't penalize him for not being in a position to have GREAT matches. It's sort of a performance based, career-focused pound-for-pound approach.
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Ric Flair
Parv has a list of matches that show Flair's breadth and how he would change up his formula for different opponents and in different situations. Sort of an argument-killer. I've been promising for years to revisit these matches all together to see if that proved to be the case or not. If he would post it here, then I will absolutely get to it in the next two years.
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Joe vs. the World #76 talking WON HOF with Dylan Hales
If you're good enough to be a nominee, you're good enough to have a comprehensive bio. There's something to that.
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NXT Takeover Fatal 4 Way
Neville recovering from the giant super 4 man bomb so quickly bugged the hell out of me. That was my big takeaway from the main.
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NXT Takeover Fatal 4 Way
Yeah, she's been great as a cocky heel lately. Very believable with her facial expressions and crowd interaction even if not everything else is there yet. Ah well.
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NXT Takeover Fatal 4 Way
I feel like someone recently made a metaphor about seeing a high school play and clapping because they were enthusiastic and you were supposed to. That's what tonight sort of feels like.
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NXT Takeover Fatal 4 Way
I don't get this crowd. You look out at the people facing hard camera, and it looks like there's only one guy enjoying himself at all.
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NXT Takeover Fatal 4 Way
The tag match had a ton of energy and a hot tag that i kind of liked but there was some stuff that was so ridiculously blown or contrived or something. Just gawkworthy stuff. That's the most I've seen the crowd into Kallisto though.
- The Rules
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Joe vs. the World #76 talking WON HOF with Dylan Hales
Misawa was so dynamic and explosively genuine I might have to sneak him on. Taue wrestled like a complete asshole though. Just full of character. That appealed to me more than the other three. I came out of watching their big tags liking Taue way more than the rest.
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The Jim Ross Is A Grouchy Hateful Vile Human Being thread
Thanks for posting the Torch Talk snippet.
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Pro Wrestling Matches Hall of Fame
That's fair, but there are different aesthetic elements and then there are completely non-aesthetic elements. I think you can categorize the first and find some sort of common ground, while I think the second is arguing about something completely different. "This match had great matwork!" "But it didn't draw money!" is a different argument than "This match had great matwork!" "But it didn't go anywhere!"
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Pro Wrestling Matches Hall of Fame
i think the main reason for some level of criteria is that it's annoying for the sake of arguments/conversations if person #1 goes "Well, this match is obviously better than this match because of X." and person number #2 goes "This match is obviously better than this match because of Y," where person 1 ignores Y completely and person 2 ignores X completely. That's just not compelling to me. You have people talking about completely different things. There's no common ground for discussion in that case so what's the point of this as a social activity past making a list.
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Joe vs. the World #76 talking WON HOF with Dylan Hales
I'm excited for the GOAT project mainly because it means I get to put Taue on and leave the other three off.
- [1998-09-21-WCW-Nitro] Raven & Kanyon vs Villano IV & Villano V
- [1998-09-14-WCW-Nitro] Ric Flair Returns!
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Pro Wrestling Matches Hall of Fame
This isn't really my sort of thing, BUT after listening to you guys talk, were I to offer a suggestion I'd say go for two lists, just like Loss has defined when it comes to the GOAT stuff. The WON style for the drawing/important/influencial, etc and then the PWO GOAT sort for the greatest aesthetically.
- [1998-09-14-WCW-Nitro] Ric Flair Returns!
- [1995-04-08-AJPW-Championship Carnival] Toshiaki Kawada vs Akira Taue
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The Jim Ross Is A Grouchy Hateful Vile Human Being thread
Can I have some timeline help? I always thought that Ross got canned due to his initial flare up in 94, but Wiki said his contract lapsed and wasn't renewed two weeks the flare up. I can't find anything in the WON at this time, except for at the very end of February where Dave mentioned that Ross would be replaced by Monsoon and Stan Lane on Challenge due to the Palsy, with nothing about his contractual situation. Then, in March, Dave said that the contract wouldn't be renewed at the end of March. Which is accurate? Was he not renewed before the flare up happened or was he not renewed only after it happened? He was hired back during the steroid trial for two months only because that's how long they figured Vince would be busy for it. Can someone clarify this?
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Greatest of All-Time project Interest?
Martin, Kelly, and I are on a fairly similar wavelength (if I can be bold enough to say, though no one's quite as crazy as me), so if Charles is going to aim things in my direction, we'd be okay with that. For everyone else, it might just serve as a good jumping off point.
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How does Austin stand up as an all-timer amid the Attitude era backlash?
Austin leaving in 02 is frustrating. I hadn't looked at those results for a long time, but he was basically set up to be in a bunch of matches with Eddy and Benoit, with Arn liberally interfering during a few matches with Flair here too. Once he left the Benoit/Flair/Eddie/Arn situation never came to be as they hotshotted Flair into babyfacehood.
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Greatest of All-Time project Interest?
My only stopping point is that I don't feel confident starting til January or at least December, but if you two are okay with that, I'm more than happy to work through it with you guys. We're not always on the same page but we do speak the same language, I think. Charles can be our guide.
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Things Wrestlers Value that we don't
I don't think we quite got to that level. Not for lack of trying though!
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Current WWE
I almost ended up going tonight. It would have been my first show since 03 or 04, but it wasn't in the cards. Let's see if I regret not going.