I'm not surprised that my take on the TLC six-man is a minority one. But I am somewhat surprised that I've come across literally no substantial criticism of the match. To me, this is as good evidence as any of the baleful legacy of ECW. Everyone seems to have forgotten what a wild brawl should look like.

 

I said in my post that I thought you could find obvious flaws with it (guys disappearing, suspect selling at times, et) but everyone came out looking better and the right guys won decisively - you aren't going to find many people tripping over themselves to shit on a modern WWE match, with good action and those results.

Ziggler as the new HBK, AJ as the new Sherri, & Big E as the new Diesel has some potential

I'm kind of with you NintendoLogic especially in regards to Ambrose in the match. I was sort of shocked to see some of the praise heaped on him since I thought some of his selling and facials were Edge overreacting bad at times.

I've been saying forever that Ambrose would be on the path to being one of the most promising guys in ages if he just toned it down by 15%

Ambrose is odd in that there are moments when he hits things just perfectly and projects better than literally anyone in modern wrestling. And then there are moments where he is indeed borderline Edgeish.

 

In general I think he's far more good than bad, but I get the criticism.

I said in my post that I thought you could find obvious flaws with it (guys disappearing, suspect selling at times, et) but everyone came out looking better and the right guys won decisively - you aren't going to find many people tripping over themselves to shit on a modern WWE match, with good action and those results.

I won't dispute that the match worked in getting The Shield over huge. But I think you can distinguish between a match that's effective from a booking standpoint and one that holds up to repeated viewings.

 

Ziggler as the new HBK, AJ as the new Sherri, & Big E as the new Diesel has some potential

One thing I absolutely hate about WWE is heels who rely on women for their heat.

 

I'm kind of with you NintendoLogic especially in regards to Ambrose in the match. I was sort of shocked to see some of the praise heaped on him since I thought some of his selling and facials were Edge overreacting bad at times.

For me, the most egregious example was when Ambrose got suplexed onto the ladder. His facial expressions were ridiculously cartoonish and over-the-top. I agree with Matt that he'd greatly benefit from turning it down a notch.

Ziggler as the new HBK, AJ as the new Sherri, & Big E as the new Diesel has some potential

AJ might actually get over as a heel if they remake her as the shrieking bitch who stomps and kicks her man's opponent while they're down (but then hides behind Big E if anyone comes back at her because if she's willing to fight men like Sherri did the fans will cheer her). If their plan is for her to just to make sexy faces and skip around Dolph after he wins this heel turn will be a dud.

I said in my post that I thought you could find obvious flaws with it (guys disappearing, suspect selling at times, et) but everyone came out looking better and the right guys won decisively - you aren't going to find many people tripping over themselves to shit on a modern WWE match, with good action and those results.

I won't dispute that the match worked in getting The Shield over huge. But I think you can distinguish between a match that's effective from a booking standpoint and one that holds up to repeated viewings.

 

 

 

I don't disagree with this at all, but that's not the point. The point is it was a WWE match that was anticipated, had good action, had a different feel from the average main event and had a satisfying finish (on multiple levels). A match like that is not going to be heavily criticized or critiqued in the immediate. In the rear view? Sure.

Ziggler as the new HBK, AJ as the new Sherri, & Big E as the new Diesel has some potential

AJ might actually get over as a heel if they remake her as the shrieking bitch who stomps and kicks her man's opponent while they're down (but then hides behind Big E if anyone comes back at her because if she's willing to fight men like Sherri did the fans will cheer her). If their plan is for her to just to make sexy faces and skip around Dolph after he wins this heel turn will be a dud.

 

I guess AJ is a notch or two above the average Diva as an overall performer, but to me she is mostly just a cute chick who looks good in a pair of skimpy jean shorts.

Ambrose is odd in that there are moments when he hits things just perfectly and projects better than literally anyone in modern wrestling. And then there are moments where he is indeed borderline Edgeish.

 

In general I think he's far more good than bad, but I get the criticism.

I agree, but so far the thing that sets Ambrose apart from Edge (for me) is that he comes off as genuinely dangerous. Edge just always looked goofy and wrestled kinda goofy. When Ambrose jumps on someone, I can buy him being an ass-kicker.

I agree that Ambrose offense really does set him apart from Edge. He does look dangerous and vicious in his brawling. Edge followed up his cartoon selling by delivering spears that I would allow my 83 year old grandmother to take. I did like the match it just didn't reach MOTYC level for me and I also really want to cheer for Ambrose I just again agree with Matt that a 15% reduction in some of the mannerisms would be ideal. I don't recall him having that problem on the indy scene so maybe it something that can be adjusted.

On the contrary, we'll just hope he's not getting coached to be *more* expressive.

Was Dean Ambrose the guy Mick Foley didn't want to work with, and if so -- has it been established what exactly the deal with that was?

I thought that was a worked shoot, but maybe not.

Foley's gone on record as a big Ambrose fan....they just didn't run with that program.

that they didn't run with it just made Ambrose look desperate and low grade

I guess he shouldn't have gone after Foley's kids then.