February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535179 I'd say Beefcake was over from the Honky program to the injury and that's about it in a long career. He could have decent watchable matches with the likes of Perfect, Savage, Rude, Martel and Dibiase. Other terrible workers, I mean did anyone in WWF actually watch El Gigante matches before they brought him in to face UT? Was George Steele any better in the 70's? Why the heck was WWF pushing Hillbilly Jim into a feud with Andre in 89? Did anyone think that would work?
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535183 Was George Steele any better in the 70's? I want to know the answer to this. Surely someone's seen stuff.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535189 It took Charles Wright forever to get over. They just kept repackaging him over and over. Even then, The Godfather had limited appeal. I don't hate him or anything. I think he was really effective as an opening match guy. But wow, he was bad in the ring for a very long time without ever getting better. That's a good call too. Also, he wasn't really *over* by himself. He was over the day he figured he would come to the ring with a dozen strippers in thongs. I don't consider that being *over*. That's the Lance Storm syndrom : you don't get over by yourself, add a slutty looking girl at your side to hide that fact and get some reaction. Dawn Marie and Major Gunns represent.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535190 Konnan was much better in Mexico than he was in WCW/TNA. He was bigger than a lot of luchadores and the "Konnan el Barbario" gimmick worked over there. He was too small to work the same gimmick in the US. He had plenty of decent to good matches before he became the catchphrase machine in the Wolfpac. It depends on what you consider good. Doing a rolling clothesline and a half ass x factor before putting on a lazy submission isnt good to me. Guys like Juvy and Rey bumping all over the place despite some of his moves taking a day to execute was more of an impressive performance to me. Granted some of Konnans matches were decent but i dont think that had anything to do with him.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535191 I think Papa Shango was pretty over until Bret beat him on TV. The live crowds were full of kids scared shitless.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535203 It seems like Mideon should be another one. I'm glad I'm not alone thinking Dennis Knight was a worthless worker. He may very well have been a hilarious guy to be around, but he was shit in the ring, from the first day I saw him as Tex Slazenger to his Naked Mideon days. Complete shit worker.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535204 Did you dislike the mini feud with Cactus Jack and the the Lethal Lottery match when they were put up against each other (which surprised the hell out of me)? I thought that stuff aged pretty well and they have one or two good matches with Scorpio/Bagwell. I haven't seen any of their WWF stuff in forever though.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535205 Did you dislike the mini feud with Cactus Jack and the the Lethal Lottery match when they were put up against each other (which surprised the hell out of me)? I thought that stuff aged pretty well and they have one or two good matches with Scorpio/Bagwell. I haven't seen any of their WWF stuff in forever though. I thought they were a perfectly fine JTTS tag team in WCW, but I'm not really feeling the Godwinns.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535208 Did you dislike the mini feud with Cactus Jack and the the Lethal Lottery match when they were put up against each other (which surprised the hell out of me)? I thought that stuff aged pretty well and they have one or two good matches with Scorpio/Bagwell. The stuff with Cactus was worthless. Scorpio/Bagwell was a good team who could get a decent match out of pretty much anyone (Scorp ruled). Plus Canterbury was a decent worker. Knight was the shits, always had been, never improved one bit.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535209 I remember liking the stuff with Cactus when I saw it a couple of years ago. But you've seen it much more recently than I. Which of the two had the run in memphis vs Lawler? Canterbury?
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535211 Whoa i had no idea either of the Godwinns feuded with Lawler. What year was this?
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535214 Oh so it was Knight not Canterbury. That sucks, i had a good image in my head of Canterbury having a nice little Memphis run. Man i wonder who else had a short forgotten Memphis run like that.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535215 It may be worth pointing out that I can't remember too many good Scott Hall matches after he left the WWF. He had a rep as a good worker because Shawn carried him to a good series, and also because he understood how to lose and make the other guy look worse for winning. There may have been a few odds and ends things here and there, but by and large, he lived off the fumes of a couple of ladder matches with Shawn for a long time.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535218 Oh his WCW run was the shits by far. Half of it was probably because he was drunk/high out of his mind and the other half was being so damn lazy and getting paid out the ass. I cant think of one good Scott Hall singles match from WCW and thats saying a lot considering how big of a character he was and how much impact he had. As Razor Ramon i thought he was pretty good, matches against Kid, Goldie, Shawn, Diesel, Bret amongst others. None of which compared to the ladder matches but they werent awful either.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535221 Would War Games 96 count? Been too many years since I last saw it to remember Scott Hall's contribution but looking at his teammates you would have to assume he did a lot for the heels. Unless fake Sting was a better worker than I remember.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535228 It may be worth pointing out that I can't remember too many good Scott Hall matches after he left the WWF. He had a rep as a good worker because Shawn carried him to a good series, and also because he understood how to lose and make the other guy look worse for winning. There may have been a few odds and ends things here and there, but by and large, he lived off the fumes of a couple of ladder matches with Shawn for a long time. I disagree. Hall had plenty of good matches in WCW, tags or single. And he was a good worker, much better than he was ever given credit for. The ladder matches with Shawn are as much his work as Shawn's to me, especially the second one. Was he past his prime in WCW and was he lazier here than he was in WWF ? Absolutely. Hall was also 38 in 1996. But the "Hall sucked in WCW" talking point is a myth to me. His ladder match with Bam Bam on January 25 1999 was quite good, and he worked hard at making it good. Hell, he worked hard to try and make Piper look half-decent, which was a lost cause to begin with. Hall gets a bad rep because of the hate for the nWo, but his work in WCW, although not as good as his WWF work, doesn't deserve that kind of bashing to me. The "Hall does the job but still makes people look bad" stuff is vastly overstated too. To be honest it never struck me at all. Hall was big on comedy goofying when he worked as a heel in WCW, and he was fun at it.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535229 The Outsiders-Luger/Giant match at Superbrawl 97 was really good. The 6-man at Slamboree 97 was another one.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535235 It may be worth pointing out that I can't remember too many good Scott Hall matches after he left the WWF. He had a rep as a good worker because Shawn carried him to a good series, and also because he understood how to lose and make the other guy look worse for winning. There may have been a few odds and ends things here and there, but by and large, he lived off the fumes of a couple of ladder matches with Shawn for a long time. I disagree. Hall had plenty of good matches in WCW, tags or single. And he was a good worker, much better than he was ever given credit for. The ladder matches with Shawn are as much his work as Shawn's to me, especially the second one. Was he past his prime in WCW and was he lazier here than he was in WWF ? Absolutely. Hall was also 38 in 1996. But the "Hall sucked in WCW" talking point is a myth to me. His ladder match with Bam Bam on January 25 1999 was quite good, and he worked hard at making it good. Hell, he worked hard to try and make Piper look half-decent, which was a lost cause to begin with. Hall gets a bad rep because of the hate for the nWo, but his work in WCW, although not as good as his WWF work, doesn't deserve that kind of bashing to me. The "Hall does the job but still makes people look bad" stuff is vastly overstated too. To be honest it never struck me at all. Hall was big on comedy goofying when he worked as a heel in WCW, and he was fun at it. Can you name a few good Hall singles matches though? I only saw the Bigelow one which i'm in the process of watching with my 99 WCw watchings. Im not saying theres no chance he had good matches its just that none stuck out to me and what i remember wasnt good
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535240 I haven't seen every Scott Hall match in WCW ever but when I took part in the Smarkschoice poll a few years ago I don't think three Scott Hall matches made my list. This might not be fair to Hall because the poll consisted of the 100 best matches in company history from late 88 to closing in 01. However, I did see a fair number of Hall and nothing jumped out at me as even decent. Some things were fine. Most of the matches with Hall that I liked were multi-mans like Slamboree 97 and War Games 96. I don't recall a singles match from that period that got me thinking "Hall's a good worker."
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535242 Jingus, the Big Daddy match is on YouTube. I think it shows that Big Daddy got away with being bad as opposed to being utterly incompetent.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535243 I haven't watched WCW 96/97 in years, so no, I don't have a list of matches in mind (plus I really don't keep records anymore). I'm not saying he was having excellent matches weekly in WCW, he was *fun* and *solid* at best, but he sure wasn't a bad worker like say, Curt Hennig was in 1998. Of course probably none of his matches there would make a top 100 WCW list. Neither would any Disco Inferno match. Doesn't mean that Disco was bad.
February 13, 201312 yr comment_5535248 Great call on Hall. Never really shined at all in WCW as I'm not sure you could point to more than few above average outings, much less anything truly memorable in the ring.
February 14, 201312 yr comment_5535298 Don Muraco sucks. Want proof? Muraco vs Santana 1/84 MSG I-C Title. http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xaapzd_ti...-ic-title_sport http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xaaros_ti...raco-pt-2_sport My comments from the Muraco thread: Well now, I understand all the Muraco is lazy talk. I mulled this over the interminable Tito headlock and I dont think a more boring match has ever happened in wrestling history. At one point Gorilla asks, "Why should he change focus away from the head?" almost as a direct Fuck You to every fan thinking that this was a total, utter snoozefest. At least Tito showed some good fire during the finish run to the lamest Double DQ in history when both men were fighting in the ropes.
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