Discuss here.

Since I mentioned her in the Kandori thread, I guess I'll start this one...

 

Essentially, Bull was great. Within her gender, she's a Top 5 candidate, and surely Top 10. She debuted a tad younger than most, got good as quick as any of them (there's a lovely little match on one of the earlier Classics episodes with I want to say Ogura, maybe for the AJW Title, that's well laid out and it's from about late 85. It's nothing extraordinary, don't get me wrong, but it's the kind of match you see from someone really early in their career and know they're on their way to being rather damn good), and in terms of one person carrying a company in-ring she did a fucking remarkable job from 1990 through to early 92 when the others started picking up. For the same old reasons she has less notable stuff after that, but matches like vs. Masami, vs. Kandori, I wish the 1/94 vs. Toyota was in full... there's no way she's not on my ballot and I'd wager she's one of the AJW workers more likely to appeal to most people on here. Essentially, Bull was fucking great.

If I had to turn in a ballot tomorrow, Bull and Dynamite Kansai would be my two highest-ranking joshi workers. That Bull was able to get tangibly over in front of a WWF audience is further proof of her broad appeal.

Can we get some "young" (read: 1980s) Bull recommendations before she became The Woman?

Definite yes for me, probably even top 50. She was, in every great way possible, the female version of Vader, except for even more agile. Perhaps the ultimate schoolyard bully, it's just a question of how much higher she moves on my list as I reacquaint myself with her this time.

Combing through the original Classics run, there're a few Bull matches from '87, but then, regrettably, nothing until 4/89 (w/Aja vs. Yamada/Mita). It's worth pointing out that, in '88, she won a lacklustre-looking JGP, dropped the AJW Title to Yumi Ogura in January and had two runs as WWA Tag Champ (w/Condor Saito 10/87 - 1/88, w/Grizzly Iwamato 2/-7/88). I've seen these matches listed on Lorefice's list (they aired, edited, on the most recent run of Classics - as did a 4/88 match with Chigusa for the White belt that I'd love to see) but I don't own them myself and the VQ is listed as, well, a throwback to an earlier time... there's also a match with Asuka from 5/89 (Korakuen, shortly after Chigusa's retirement) that's only aired on the recent, edited, classics show...

 

Of those '87 matches, there's a singles match with Devil (4/27, or the show where Hokuto breaks her neck - episode #60) that is going along nice enough but ends abruptly when Devil drops Bull backwards off her shoulders whilst Bull is choking her with the nunchucks. Bull appears to hurt her neck/shoulder and Devil just pins her off it. There's a longer match for the AJW Title from 2/26 vs. Yasuko Ishiguro (underneath Chigusa vs. Asuka) that on a re-watch tonight has Bull selling well and some strong work turning the lateral press into a near fall in itself (which only the rookies would do later but it works well and the crowd react big for it). I'd have to re-watch more stuff from the time to see if it's a Bull thing or a company thing, but my gut says the latter. The third (7/20, on the same episode as the previous match - #38) vs. Hotta, which goes to a 30:00 draw. With Bull positioned as the dominant heel there's, again, hints at what she'd be a few years later, but 30:00 is at least twice as long as it needed to be and they repeat themselves enough to make the Fuji TV editors' job a doddle. Then again, said editors were fantastic and no doubt deserved a night off.

 

Basically, Bull was still developing at the time. Had the Devil match gone longer there'd be something worth watching, but neither of the other two matches were really set-up in a way for her to impress/are not worth the non-completest checking out. If more of that stuff mentioned in the first paragraph aired on the original run (i.e. in full) it would be different, but with what we have available Bull's "candidacy" rests on her run carrying the company and various matches after.

Bull was basically a good worker from the beginning. Once she over the fact that she had to be a heel (legend has it she cried when they cut her hair since nobody really wanted to be a heel in those days), she quickly blossomed. Her most difficult growth period was when they first pushed her as the top woman before she gained all the weight. She didn't really have the tools to be on top at first and there were some growing pains. She had been very comfortable in her tag roles up to that point. The Bull/Condor team was a strong mid card act and I remember enjoying a lot of their matches. The entire 80s mid card is underrated/unknown. You have to be into your Joshi to enjoy it, but they became a great crew around '87.

I have a blind spot with Bull before she became the top dog and after her Dump's Army stuff, but everything from when she got on top moving forward is really strong stuff. She'll be on my list somewhere.

I have LOVED every Bull match I have seen, but the amount I have seen is pretty low. Can anybody make a watch list for her?

I don't have a list in mind, I haven't watched joshi since 2003 or so. But damn, those matches with Aja Kong in 91/92 and with Kyoko Inoue in 95 were just terrific. Bull was an amazing worker.

Very likely the top diva on my ballot.

Very likely the top diva on my ballot.

 

Bull would probably make you bleed until you pass out for this.

 

Very likely the top diva on my ballot.

 

Bull would probably make you bleed until you pass out for this.

 

 

I can only hope. It'd be an honor to see if she can drag me to something watchable. Look at how many boxes she ticks off -- amazing, all-time great wrestler. All-time hair. Pretty (certainly not to all but she always looked sweet). Party girl, if the WWF firing story is legit. Golfer. Must love to drink. We'd probably have an awesome time hanging out even with the language barrier.

Bull is the best. I had a weird crush on her back when she showed up in the WWF, and, after going through some of her stuff for this, I think I still have a weird crush on her. I don't know if she quite matches Aja for monster heel offence, but she definitely sells better, and conveys more emotion and vulnerability than Aja did. Maybe not a great long-term seller, but I thought her in-the-moment selling was excellent, and she could be really sympathetic when the moment called for it. I'm nowhere near the point of thinking about where people are going to rank yet, but Bull has a very real shot at being my top female wrestler.

Party girl, if the WWF firing story is legit.

 

Don't know about that one. Me want dirt. What's the story ?

 

And yeah, Bull is the coolest. Add to the fact she lost tons of weight and became a MILF golfer. What's not to love about her ? (I'm a big time Aja fan, but I do think Bull was better overall)

This has nothing to do with her candidacy, but her look as Dump's second lieutenant was so much cooler than the one she adopted as the top star.

She reminded me of the cool girl from Arthur, who was in Binky's clique. I'm sure nobody knows what on earth I'm talking about, but I'm too lazy to get a pic.

Didn't she get busted for coke?

 

Love Bull, she'll rank either 3rd or 4th amongst the joshi stars. Don't even think I'm gonna rank Aja Kong at this point. Overrated bore.

 

Party girl, if the WWF firing story is legit.

 

Don't know about that one. Me want dirt. What's the story ?

 

And yeah, Bull is the coolest. Add to the fact she lost tons of weight and became a MILF golfer. What's not to love about her ? (I'm a big time Aja fan, but I do think Bull was better overall)

 

 

Reportedly fired due to a drug test failure for coke. DIVA!

Bull has been one of the more frustrating wrestlers to watch for this project. Clearly a very good wrestler: Really great offense, very good seller, to the point where her selling keeps me interested in otherwise messy matches, and better than most in the early time killing sections that so many of these matches have. All that and I just can't seem to find the matches to piece a case for her together. It's surprisingly rare for her to really work like a monster, and more often than not she's playing second fiddle in a tag. OJ's comment above that she didn't want to be a heel seems strangely fitting, as she has a lot of matches where she sells sympathetic. The stuff where she actually works like a beast is very fun, but it's not the type of truely great stuff that I could point to in order to justify her as an all-timer. The short career is obviously a bummer. The comments above that she's better than Aja seem ridiculous. Clearly she has a few things that Aja lacks, and you could argue that she was the better worker from 1990-95, but Aja's resume stomps hers and Aja also has the standout performances that I've been sorely missing with Bull. I don't know, if somebody wants to do a big match dump of really great Bull performances now is the time, because currently she doesn't cut it for me in a list of all-time greats.

One of the best wrestlers of all time. Good from the very beginning, great until the very end. Exceled at every role be it youngster corrupted by Dump, The Ace, or the Former Legend. Awesome in classic title matches. One of the best brawlers ever. Best working monster ever (Sorry Vader sorry Aja). Had two of the iconic finishers of her era (Top rope Legdrop & Top Rope  Somersault Legdrop). Best look in wrestling history aside from only Andre who had a biological advantage (for wrestling not for life).  A wrestler I couldn't imagine someone not liking if they watched her. Watch her against Aja, Kyoko, Hokuto, Kandori, Devil, really just watch all of her matches.  Who was cooler than Bull Nakano? Nobody. 

If I was only measuring coolness she'd rank highly. There are 20-30 women easily better.  

Who are they?

I'm about to make some popcorn for that list. I only have two women above Bull.

Whoever they are, not a damn one of them wore Megadeth shirts to the ring.