Really gonna be interested in seeing how Punk fares in AEW as even their big "storytelling" matches are very athletic and full of high spots, and Punk wasn't even a good athlete in his 20s and 30s

56 minutes ago, strobogo said:

Really gonna be interested in seeing how Punk fares in AEW as even their big "storytelling" matches are very athletic and full of high spots, and Punk wasn't even a good athlete in his 20s and 30s

counterpoint: Moxley & Kingston

17 minutes ago, funkdoc said:

counterpoint: Moxley & Kingston

Counter counterpoint: Moxley has sucked in AEW just like he sucked the majority of his WWE run and the only time he's really seemed to give a shit since leaving WWE is when mixed up with NJPW stuff. Kingston is Kingston and I don't think he's had any particularly good matches in AEW either. 

The point is they've become some of the most over guys in the promotion even though they don't fit the mold you describe either.  Punk will be fine in that regard.

If you'd argue that Punk's matches in AEW aren't likely to add to his GWE case, i could see that, sure.  But i feel like Punk is more of a candidate for the "overall experience" kind of voter than the "matches" voter anyway.

10 hours ago, strobogo said:

the only time he's really seemed to give a shit since leaving WWE is when mixed up with NJPW stuff.

He seems to be having a grand ol' time since being allowed to have chest and arm hair again. "Uninterested" is pretty much the last adjective I'd use to describe Moxley's time in AEW. Even Blind Freddy would call him "motivated" or "excited".

13 hours ago, strobogo said:

Counter counterpoint: Moxley has sucked in AEW just like he sucked the majority of his WWE run and the only time he's really seemed to give a shit since leaving WWE is when mixed up with NJPW stuff. Kingston is Kingston and I don't think he's had any particularly good matches in AEW either. 

Try his match in Bloodsport. It's a doozy.

14 hours ago, Dav'oh said:

He seems to be having a grand ol' time since being allowed to have chest and arm hair again. "Uninterested" is pretty much the last adjective I'd use to describe Moxley's time in AEW. Even Blind Freddy would call him "motivated" or "excited".

Dude seems like he's been sleepwalking since last summer to me. He seemed to start having fun when the team with Kingston first started but he's seemed pretty bored to me all year. Body going to shit, too

I think Moxley seems like he's having fun, and I like the idea of him and Kingston as a team of dad bod warriors. The issue is that he's just not very good

Mox has always seemed incredibly motivated since leaving WWE. He's definitely not the best in-ring worker in AEW, but the only downright bad match I saw him have was that endless FCA match with Hager. 

It's all true about Punk- he's not naturally athletic and still awkward. But that's part of his charm. He earns everything he does. He already is the best storyteller in AEW. He demands respect and gets it. He is treated like an icon. His attention to detail and kayfabe are top notch. The live fans have appreciated his methodical pacing and "struggle" to win matches against younger talent- no flips or insane bumps needed. He's basically the modern version of Bret Hart in AEW. Punk is doing long term character work and hasn't been better since his WWE title run. His body of work on paper in AEW is not there yet, of course. But it will be in a year or two.

And I say this as someone who was very disappointed with his MMA-era interviews, the FOX stuff, and the Twitter nonsense with the Miz and Cody.

He's a great talker, I'll give him that. Guy can work a crowd like nobody's business. In terms of workrate, he's a lot more iffy and tends to not be capable of carrying very well against opponents that are below his skill level, especially when he's demotivated and can't be bothered. Like a good few other wrestlers, you can tell when Punk doesn't care and when he does, namely by how he conducts himself in the ring. Sure, many have this quality: it's only natural after all: but Punk is particularly noticeable. This has the opposite effect when he DOES care: the Cena series, Joe bouts and Undertaker WM fight are all examples of a motivated Punk giving some big fire in his responses. 

Punk is far better as a heel than as a face. I never brought him as a face personally: he's just not really built for that role in general, and that's fine. Him suiting a crazed zealot or a egomaniac just comes more naturally, and he makes heat so easy to grasp that it's almost insulting at points. IWA crowds hated the crap out of him at points. I just hate when he tried the "cool heel" stuff he tended to lean into at times and more the out and out mean heel he showcases a lot during his early days. Like workrate wise, he's painfully average and likely would've been dumped in the undercard of any major Japanese promotion, which is probably why he never attempted to do so like his peers at the time. That and, well, most of his moveset was stolen from other guys anyway, so he probably would've got confused reactions like Joe did when he went over to NOAH for those disastrous matches. His indie stuff from what I've seen has mostly aged well.....most, anyway. There's annoying tendencies that pop up that do get annoying, way too many overkill finishes for one.

Would Punk get a top 100 spot? Eh. While he has really big high spots in his career, there's a lot of, well, nothing in-between, and even those high spots are marred by bad payoffs or whatnot. If we were doing top 100 promos, he'd have a spot easily. He might have one in general but it would need to be quite high up given there are countless acts that can run circles around him. His current AEW work doesn't really set me one way or another: he's had good matches at best and completely dull ones at worst, I'll need to see how he does when he inevitably moves up the card. I want to see what a Danielson could do with current Punk mainly. 

 

 

Punk's a guy I've always rooted for, but has mostly underwhelmed in the ring. As a face or heel, he can always talk me into getting hyped up for his matches. He's a master at building a match so it feels meaningful and important. I'm paraphrasing but I remember Mick Foley saying the key to a feud is that you need to be able to believe both guys genuinely think they're in the right, and Punk is perhaps the best in the world at this. But I mostly come away disappointed by the match itself.

Punk is like a 100/99 if he makes the list. He has great ring psychology, and he got over a very simple, old-school move set in workrate-heavy AEW. I love Punk as a personality, he brings a realness most other wrestlers can’t dream of. But let’s be real, he’s sloppy as shit, has a very unconvincing physique, and he destroyed some of his mystique losing to tomato cans in MMA.