That reminds me--I'd like to see a discussion of the transition between local promos and Event Centers, which happened I think with the first syndie shows to air after WM4. Along with the change in format (which had to have saved untold amounts of time for everyone), house shows began to get more uniform. Savage did have I think a handful of one-off defenses against Boss Man and King Haku, but otherwise you had a traveling troupe putting on the same show each night as opposed to things being booked for one particular city.

 

Compare and contrast Hogan in the '80s to Hogan as champion in '89 and '91. You didn't see any Hogan-Mountie, or Hogan-Martel main events. The only "random" guy he faced in '91 was the Warlord for a few shows in the fall, after Slaughter was finished but when it was too early to have him facing Undertaker or Flair.

Yeah and other than 1 TV taping I don't think Hogan ever faced Undertaker one on one in house shows either. I agree the change wasn't done TO Savage on purpose but it was done.

 

You are right about Event Center promos. Actually I'd like to hear some discussion about Sean Mooney. Particularly his evolution from SHOUTING AT THE TOP OF HIS LUNGS (yet oddly not being that loud) Event Center Sean Mooney in 1988 to a more normal human being. Granted this will involve Parv, once he regains net, having to watch hours of Sean Mooney footage to determine when and how the change occurred, but asking Parv to watch Sean Mooney footage is like asking most of us to agree to sleep with supermodels.

One of the things that bugs me about Savage's title reign was the poor variety of his opponents. He fought against Dibiase, Andre, Bad News and occasionally Akeem. That's about it other than a few TV matches.

 

Compare that to Hogan in any year 84-87 and he took on EVERYONE. That Dibiase feud lasted way longer than it had too to be honest at least as far as house shows go. A Rude program would have made perfect sense (assuming Randy would play ball on Rude hitting on Liz). Perfect would have been tougher because you'd have to job him out early and that kinda ends the perfect gimmick. But in general there are a lot of heels Randy SHOULD have had matches with in 88 that he didn't.

This is a great post. Savage vs Rude just writes itself. Who was Hogan working with on the houses at this time? I feel like he was still doing his "Hulk vs the world" tour. Possibly a subtle burial of Savage on Hogan's part? Savage as number two to Hogan's number one is something that unfortunately followed him everywhere he went.

Parv should seek out the Mark Jennings Event Center footage from 1991.

I don't think any of that is available besides what aired on Now It Can Be Told. I believe it's been determined that he did some Event Centers for the Springfield, MA market, and maybe a few others--but none of the places where most of the circulating footage seems to come from (Boston, NYC, and Nashville). It would be kind of a holy grail in a way, but if Bix hasn't found any (to my knowledge) then I doubt Parv can. Sorry, Parv.

That reminds me--I'd like to see a discussion of the transition between local promos and Event Centers, which happened I think with the first syndie shows to air after WM4. Along with the change in format (which had to have saved untold amounts of time for everyone), house shows began to get more uniform. Savage did have I think a handful of one-off defenses against Boss Man and King Haku, but otherwise you had a traveling troupe putting on the same show each night as opposed to things being booked for one particular city.

 

Compare and contrast Hogan in the '80s to Hogan as champion in '89 and '91. You didn't see any Hogan-Mountie, or Hogan-Martel main events. The only "random" guy he faced in '91 was the Warlord for a few shows in the fall, after Slaughter was finished but when it was too early to have him facing Undertaker or Flair.

Post WMIV is when the WWF shifted from the Video One production company and established it's own in house studio, you also have stuff like the debut of the Green Screen and the commentary being done in a studio instead of at the tapings which is very noticeable

 

As far as booking goes, the feuds would start to get really dragged out in 89/90, worst offenders being Dusty having 3 feuds in 18 months and Jake having 3 feuds from WMV to VII, it makes the early Survivor Series really fun just for the freshness of the pairings you would see

 

Green Sean Mooney is amazing

 

Letters from Kayfabe #16

http://placetobenation.com/letters-from-kayfabe-16/

Allan and Parv wish everyone a happy Christmas by getting all nostalgic about their WWF memories.

1. The Mailbag: “Make a Difference” Fatu / Reo Rogers / 123 Kid’s upset win vs. Razor Ramon

2. The Event Center with JR Rozzero: Memories of Christmas Wrestling presents

3. The Long Topic: Our favourite WWF Memories

To write in to the mailbag there is now an email address, [email protected] or send a self-addressed envelop to PO BOX 227, Kayfabe Towers.

Youtube playlist:

The weirdest thing about Kid losing at Summerslam was that he was starting a program with Shawn for the Intercontinental Title at the next TV

 

 

 

Finally got around to listening to episode 16 today. An enjoyable listen as always.

Letters From Kayfabe #17

http://placetobenation.com/letters-from-kayfabe-17/

Allan and Parv crash into 2017 with the 17th edition of Letters from Kayfabe.

1. The Mailbag: Yokozuna bodyslam challenge / Lance Cassidy / previous women wrestlers vs. Divas Revolution

2. The Event Center with JT Rozzero: No Holds Barred: the Match the Movie

3. The Long Topic: Talk show segments that weren’t Piper’s Pit

To write in to the mailbag there is now an email address, [email protected] or send a self-addressed envelop to PO BOX 227, Kayfabe Towers.

Bonus PTBN article on the Yokozuna bodyslam challenge here: http://placetobenation.com/scott-jts-vintage-vault-refresh-monday-night-raw-7593/

The YouTube playlist:

The Pro Wrestling Only Network features great shows you can find right here at Place to Be Nation. By subscribing on iTunes (https://itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/ptbn-wrestling-network/id715657490?mt=2) or SoundCloud (http://soundcloud.com/prowrestlingonly), you’ll have access to new episodes, bonus content, as well as a complete archive of all shows on the Network!

For more on the great family of podcasts at Place to Be Nation, click here: http://placetobenation.com/podcasts

Sunny also briefly had a talk show segment in 1997 that was exclusive to Shotgun called "Undercover with Sunny" where Sunny would be in a bed on top of the ramp and interview wrestlers from the bed.

Another random note... Brother Love Show made a brief return in December 95 on Raw. That is where the Ringmaster debuted. It hung around for a few weeks and then vanished.

Thank you for the corrections brothers! The annoying this was I was tweeting about Austin on the Brother Love show the other day on my daily #OnThisDay tweets!

Thank you for the corrections brothers! The annoying this was I was tweeting about Austin on the Brother Love show the other day on my daily #OnThisDay tweets!

 

ALSO YOU DIDN'T MENTION EVERY DARK MATCH THAT OCCURRED WHEN THEY RECORDED THOSE PIPER'S PITS!

10 year old Fishbaugh's 3 least favorite things of 1990:

 

1. Divorce of parents

2. Matt Bahr's field goal to beat the 49ers in the NFC Championship

3. The Brother Love show

 

The gap between 2 and 3 isn't as large as you might think.

Sunny also briefly had a talk show segment in 1997 that was exclusive to Shotgun called "Undercover with Sunny" where Sunny would be in a bed on top of the ramp and interview wrestlers from the bed.

 

Vader on Undercover With Sunny was fantastic.

Dear Allan and Parv,

 

Would love to hear you talk about the original Demolition line up of Bill Eadie and Randy Colley.

I've heard Colley was replaced as Smash because fans recognised him as Moondog Rex but that never stopped Vince with other gimmicks such as Akeem obviously being OMG and Iron Sheik as Col.Mustafa as you've previously discussed on the show.

Also how and why they replaced Luscious Johnny V with Mr. Fuji?

Thanks guys,

AJ

Just listened. Thanks Parv for the shout out for my insanely complex and lengthy defense of Trish. The fact that basically no one talked with me convinced me I was wasting my time, and should focus on those things others want to talk about. But then I'm ignored then frequently too. It was glad that someone was at least taking note of my efforts.

 

I do agree today women are treated better in WWE than ever before but I could see interest dying really fast if Charlotte stays on top another year. It's becoming the female version of 2002 HHH to be honest. I think especially with the interest in women's wrestling shooting up, fans have to be kept happy to be kept interested and another year of a heel who never loses the big one might nip that in the bud.

 

As for Zeus, my memory is he wasn't played as the character from the movie exactly. Many times they referred to how Zeus would keep going after the director yelled cut and get in a few shots on Hogan. It wasn't as if the movie was real or anything like that. It was as if some guy named Zeus showed up to play Zeus. It was just odd.

Episode 18:

 

http://placetobenation.com/letters-from-kayfabe-18/

 

 

This week Allan and Parv go so long in the mailbag that they never get to the long topic.

 

1. The Mailbag: Andre in 91 / Celebrities / Luscious Johnny V

2. The Event Center with JT Rozzero: Saturday Night’s Main Event IX

 

To write in to the mailbag there is now an email address, [email protected] or send a self-addressed envelop to PO BOX 227, Kayfabe Towers. Or tweet #LettersfromKayfabe to @allan_cheapshot and @jerryvonk

 

The Playlist:

Dear Allan and Parv,

 

Would love to hear you talk about the original Demolition line up of Bill Eadie and Randy Colley.

I've heard Colley was replaced as Smash because fans recognised him as Moondog Rex but that never stopped Vince with other gimmicks such as Akeem obviously being OMG and Iron Sheik as Col.Mustafa as you've previously discussed on the show.

Also how and why they replaced Luscious Johnny V with Mr. Fuji?

Thanks guys,

AJ

 

We answer some of this on this weeks show with another listener question

The big difference from Rex/Smash is that they never tried to claim OMG and Akeem were two different people--they outright said the Gang had been "reborn."

 

Sheik/Mustafa was a little weird...sometimes they acted like Mustafa was completely new, other times Vince would acknowledge him as a former WWF Champion, and sometimes it wasn't really talked about one way or the other.

With Col Mustafa, Roddy Piper botched it right would of the gate by saying "That's the Iron Sheik!"

 

Ironically though, Darsow Smash became Repo Man. As I've said before, when I was a kid I had ZERO idea that Repo Man was Smash. Like none.

Me neither. It was one of those things I learned from the internet around 1998. Say what you will about Darsow and the gimmick but he he threw himself into it with fervor.

Re: Repo Man, I never would have guessed it myself either, but that was one of the secrets that PWI broke for me.

 

I have to think Piper blurting out "That's the Iron Sheik!" was intentional, or at least approved. That shit was taped after the fact--just like his proclamation of "THAT'S TONY ATLAS!", it wouldn't have made it into the final cut if Vince really didn't want it there.

They occasionally mentioned Mustafa was Iron Sheik several other times as well, not just his debut.

​SD Jones vs. Johnny V which you guys hadn't tracked down is the first match on both of these house shows:

​Spectrum 3/12/88:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oULynQJUXCQ

Copps Coliseum 3/13/88:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHlg3dkj_Jc