Yeah, Cena on PPV is sort of hit or miss for me. Maybe it's because I have soured on his big match formula so some of the matches I used to really like, I don't have the same fondness for. It'll be interesting to see how his work holds up years from now. The unique stuff (vs. Brock, vs. Umaga) is probably timeless but not sure about standard Big Match John.

Well I'm struggling to think of bad ones so that should say something.

Yeah, Cena on PPV is sort of hit or miss for me. Maybe it's because I have soured on his big match formula so some of the matches I used to really like, I don't have the same fondness for. It'll be interesting to see how his work holds up years from now. The unique stuff (vs. Brock, vs. Umaga) is probably timeless but not sure about standard Big Match John.

Would you say it's a quality or personal taste thing? There are a lot of times where I can sit there and say that was a good match but it really didn't do much for me.

The Ace match.

 

I'm still not sure I've forgiven WWE for not letting Punk-Bryan close that show when that was Cena's match.

Well I'm struggling to think of bad ones so that should say something.

I suppose it does.

 

Would like to hear more from you on this. Do you have a Cena great matches list from the GWE days?

Well I'm struggling to think of bad ones so that should say something.

I'd say his PPV matches vs Sheamus were, as far as Cena PPV matches go, bad.

Worst PPV matches according to Meltzer, close to bottom 10 percent:

 

vs. Orton (Unforgiven 2007) - Only negative star Cena PPV match

vs. Laurinaitis (Over The Limit 2012) - DUD

vs. The Miz (Bash 2009) - DUD

vs. JBL (Bash 2008) - 1 star

vs. Edge (NYR 2006) - 1 star, not even really a match, MITB cash in

vs. The Miz (WM XXVII) - 1.25

vs. Big Show (Judgment Day 2009) - 1.25

w/Batista vs. Booker & Finlay (Armageddon 2006) - 1.25

vs. JBL (WM XXI) - 1.25

vs. Big Show (WM XX) - 1.25

w/ Palumbo & Stamboli vs. Benoit/Rhyno/Spanky - (Judgment Day 2003) - 1.25

vs. Brock (Backlash 2003) - 1.25

vs. Jericho (Vengeance 2002) - 1.25

w/Otunga vs. Cody/McIntyre (Bragging Rights 2010) - 1.5

vs. Big Show (Extreme Rules 2010) - 1.5

vs. JBL (Judgment Day 2008) - 1.5

vs. Bray Wyatt (Extreme Rules 2014) - 1.75

vs. Khali (Judgment Day 2007) - 1.75

Survivor Series Match (2004) - 1.75

 

I'm sure that Khali rating is going to rile some people up.

I would say it would fall somewhere in the middle of that list so bottom 10% seems like a more than accurate statement.

What is frustrating about the Corbin match is that Baron is just the type of guy that could have a BANGER of a match with Cena with the proper time. Their first SD match (that also was a bit short, but good) was also a sign of that.

 

Maybe if not for Corbin getting some flak for his twitter antics, this could've been very good, but was just solid, which is a dissapointment.

 

 

Also lol @ that Khali match having that rating.

What's the best Cena-Show match? It seems like they've feuded at least five or six times, right?

Smackdown 27.2.09.

 

 

Well I'm struggling to think of bad ones so that should say something.

I suppose it does.

 

Would like to hear more from you on this. Do you have a Cena great matches list from the GWE days?

 

 

I haven't forgotten about this by the way. I just have to find a moment to answer it properly, since it is of interest to me in terms of GWWE as well.

Dave gave Cena/Corbin 2 stars putting it just outside the realm of bottom 10%.

vs. Khali (Judgment Day 2007) - 1.75

 

 

I'm sure that Khali rating is going to rile some people up.

 

I'm in shock. I am going to assume you made up that rating to smear Dave's name.

 

vs. Khali (Judgment Day 2007) - 1.75

 

 

I'm sure that Khali rating is going to rile some people up.

 

I'm in shock. I am going to assume you made up that rating to smear Dave's name.

 

 

Any fans of the match willing to defend it? I had reviewed it in the MDA a while ago and gave it 1.5*. Didn't get the hype at all.

 

Yeah, Cena on PPV is sort of hit or miss for me. Maybe it's because I have soured on his big match formula so some of the matches I used to really like, I don't have the same fondness for. It'll be interesting to see how his work holds up years from now. The unique stuff (vs. Brock, vs. Umaga) is probably timeless but not sure about standard Big Match John.

Would you say it's a quality or personal taste thing? There are a lot of times where I can sit there and say that was a good match but it really didn't do much for me.

 

 

I guess quality wise. What hurts Cena for me is a lack of great matches. Plenty of good (even very good) matches over the years but very few truly high end ones.

 

 

 

 

vs. Khali (Judgment Day 2007) - 1.75

 

 

I'm sure that Khali rating is going to rile some people up.

I'm in shock. I am going to assume you made up that rating to smear Dave's name.

Any fans of the match willing to defend it? I had reviewed it in the MDA a while ago and gave it 1.5*. Didn't get the hype at all.

It's a genuinely great match and you and Dave are quite insane. Is my defence.

Fair enough.

This is what I said about the Cena/Khali match:

 

John Cena Vs The Great Khali: This was my first time seeing this match, and I always wondered about the praise it got, and people saying it was a legit great match, and citing this as proof that Cena is an all-time great and what have you. So I was kinda expecting to be disappointed given the hype, but I really wasn't. I mean, I don't think it's a great match, but it is definitely a good match, and definitely a great Cena performance. He really makes Khali look like a monster with his selling and bumping, and the timing of the comebacks, the cutouts and the general layout are all excellent. This very much reminded me of a Hogan-type match, where Cena is basically getting his ass kicked the whole match and just building to that comeback. But the finish is more of a lucky one than what you'd get in a Hogan match, and Cena sells that sense that he's fortunate to survive really well too. Yes, I enjoyed this match a lot.

 

I gave it 3 1/2 stars. I'm really tight with my ratings, so 3 1/2 is a very good rating. I also don't think Cena is a superworker, and would say he probably has as many bad matches as good ones. Just for a sense of context.

What's the best Cena-Show match? It seems like they've feuded at least five or six times, right?

 

They had a good match on Smackdown sometime in 2008. I can't recall the exact date, though.

This very much reminded me of a Hogan-type match,

 

Maybe this explains why I didn't like it, even though Cena is way better at selling than Hogan.

 

 

I gave it 3 1/2 stars. I'm really tight with my ratings, so 3 1/2 is a very good rating. I also don't think Cena is a superworker, and would say he probably has as many bad matches as good ones.

 

I agree with this assessment.

I'm going through them now and I feel this is demonstrably false, at least in terms of PPV matches.

John Cena is a guy who is usually good at getting better than expected matches out of his opponents, which I feel sometimes causes them to be viewed as better than they actually were due to low expectations. Like the Khali matches weren't really all that great, but they were a hell of a lot better than anyone thought they could possibly be so they must be three stars.

I don't know if there's a wrestling opinion I've read that I disagree with more than "Cena is way better at selling than Hogan." That was one of the things that I thought he was the best at.

Shaking leg from bodyslam was awful, but everything else about his selling I liked.

A lot of the criticisms I've come across regarding Cena's selling (I've even had a few myself) is that he pops up or manages some kind of reversal 30-60 seconds after taking a big move, which to be fair isn't all that out of place in a NJPW match (and this is coming from a huge NJPW fan). But I think there are a lot instances where Cena's selling made his opponent seem like a huge threat (the Khali and Brock matches come to mind).